I want to stop using emacs, but I can't find a good replacement 😞

maybe because there isn’t

did you try spacemacs ?

No, is it good?

well it’s an emacs config

My main problems are that I can't make emacs work decently on my win machine and that I use emacs shortcuts when I'm using other softwares making a mess 😄

and you choose vi-like keyboard shortcuts, or emacs-like

oh, ok

not using win anymore

Yeah, sadly I have to on one of my pcs

I like Cursive.

intellij scares me a little... is lighttable dead?

light table just recently had a major update - definitely not dead

@doddenino: I am curious, why are you scared of IntelliJ?

What do folks think of nightcode? Seems to be the first thing I've picked up

When I tried it, I found it nice to get started, but I never really figured out if I could use standard leiningen projects with it, or generate from it

However, being a beginner and looking into games I would try it definitely

@sveri I tried using it years ago with javascript, and I thought it was too heavy and trying to do too many things

@doddenino: Ah, I see, well, thats a point and, thats what its there for. If these two things scare you away, well then, nothing to add 😧

😄

@sveri maybe I should give it another go... The point is that I use javascript at work and I clj/cljs as a hobby, and I'd like to use the same editor for everything

Hm, I think there is no decent free javascript plugin for IntelliJ, or do you have a paid version?

Cursive is free for testing basically

Well non-commercial

I think I'm much too new to really have an opinion but I don't understand what cursive gives you other than IntelliJ familiarity. Since it doesn't really use a Leiningen template to start you off with a new project.

@doddenino: webstorm is great for JavaScript. I had to stop using it only because I think my Mac can't run webstorm and Xcode at the same time very well (React Native development)

cursive gives you a lot, what I find incredibly useful is the refactoring and the REPL, also that I can assign shortcuts for everything I need. Of course, IntelliJ features themselves are great too, in my mind. So it is a nice combination. Besides that there are of course a lot of other features that ppl might find useful.

@sveri: and you'd consider it fine for long-term Clojure and clojurescript development?

Definitely. Although I only use it for hobby stuff. But I do so for more than a year now and left everything else behind.

If you want to develop commercial stuff you are required to buy a license

But, also I have to say I always adviced newcomers to use Lighttable because of the inline editing.

It's a nice feature that gives instant feedback and I found it very useful for the first year when exploring clojure

What's inline editing?

It's hard to explain, please see here: http://lighttable.com/ under inline evalution

Ah ok I see it. Basically like a debugger in a sense

Yea, kind of

This actually looks really nice. I should play with it

Also when I thaught clojure at my office in the first course it took everyone not more than 15 minutes to get started with lighttable and clojure (given java was already installed).

So, Lighttable for instant feedback and cursive for project development, that's how I use it.

Makes sense to me

In terms of higher level project structure, when do I know to break from core.cls

.clj

And how are source files included? Is that something in every new Leiningen project that I've just overlooked so far

Hm, the first question is not related to clojure at all, but a general question. Of course it depends on the programming language, but as a general rule, use a separate namespace for separate concerns

True. But it's not really classes, or... Hmm

I will probably just need to read more Clojure projects

Yea, for me they often have a bit a broader spectrum than classes

But not always

The :requires value is good to watch. When it becomes unwieldy or unfocused, time to consider another ns.

For instance I usually have a routes file for every resource. and the routes file only cares for rendering the template and retrieving the data for it. If it gets to much code in that routes file I create a service namespace for that route

Or when you start coding to an abstraction and can move the impl details elsewhere

so like user -> routes / db / service /

Cursive is awesome. Initially I used LightTable and then tried spacemacs, but settled on Cursive. I'm very happy with it.

I usually suggest Cursive to newcomers also. A colleague of mine tried to open a project with non-default source folders in Eclipse and it looked a bit screwed.

I've bought a Cursive license, but I keep coming back to Emacs just because I'm so used to it

There is also Proton, which is basically an Atom-based spacemacs with Parinfer and REPL integration. See #C0GCNE3B3 for details.