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2018-02-19
Channels
- # beginners (134)
- # boot (4)
- # cider (23)
- # clara (2)
- # cljs-dev (2)
- # cljsrn (4)
- # clojure (147)
- # clojure-austin (9)
- # clojure-berlin (2)
- # clojure-dusseldorf (2)
- # clojure-france (2)
- # clojure-italy (11)
- # clojure-russia (1)
- # clojure-spec (18)
- # clojure-uk (182)
- # clojurescript (40)
- # community-development (5)
- # cursive (29)
- # datascript (6)
- # datomic (18)
- # duct (6)
- # emacs (4)
- # events (1)
- # fulcro (46)
- # hoplon (5)
- # jobs-discuss (12)
- # keechma (1)
- # luminus (7)
- # lumo (1)
- # off-topic (11)
- # onyx (9)
- # parinfer (5)
- # protorepl (1)
- # re-frame (18)
- # reagent (23)
- # reitit (2)
- # ring (5)
- # ring-swagger (20)
- # schema (1)
- # shadow-cljs (32)
- # spacemacs (1)
- # specter (2)
- # vim (26)
I am -- but it's mid-afternoon for me š
Hehe - Heya @seancorfield š
Warm and sunny š
Although, today, it's windy...
morning
Morning š
Back when I decided to learn to touch type, I reasoned that if I were going to do it, I should do it properly. Throw away the shackles of the past (QWERTY) and use a more efficient layout.
I learned to touchtype at school and there was no option. I didn't even learn about Azerty and Dvorak keyboards until I was past Uni.
was quite tempted by colemak at one point, a bit closer to qwerty, so thought it'd be easier to transition - never stuck, though seems to take a long time to get up to the same speed
One time I took my laptop (Mac) to the Apple store, and the āGeniusā realised something was weird with the keyboard when he started typing. I said āOh, sorry, itās Dvorak, let me change thatā or something. He knew what it was - which hardly anybody outside programmers do - and told me he had a son who typed dvorak because he had reduced hand function in his left hand, and it worked better for him. I just thought that was a cool story.
My biggest issue with switching to an alternative layout is that the vim homerow is extremely well optimized. I'm not sure what I'd do to operate with an alternative layout.
(also I was never a proper vim power user - I mean I can do more than a lot of people but never scratched the surface with Vim, really)
Has anyone built a form with Reagent that needs to update in-place when the user makes a choice, i.e. user picks a specific option in a select and more fields / controls appear in the form..? I am sure that I am being a n00b, but I can't figure out the way to do it that does not require me to have a completely different form that is rendered in instead if the user makes the choice that requires more fields.
Morning @jasonbell
I find myself amused, but shocked at the same time @jasonbell, in a "Moi?" sort of a way š
Jade in the house!
I'm good thanks @maleghast, well I was until @yogidevbear made the common naming faux pas š
@maleghast when a selection is made update some key in your app-db ... make the rendering of the alternative form options conditional on the value of that key
(if you are not using re-frame you will presumably still have some atom containing your app-db equivalent)
@mccraigmccraig - Thx, this is the conclusion that I had come to with some other help, but I was Hoping__ that there was a solution that did not include "polluting" the app-db (@app-state in my app) with form-state information.
@maleghast @app-state is your view-model (not just an abstract app-model)... it should rightfully contain form-state information
I'm sure I've seen some people on the Internet suggest having more transient state in a normal reagent local atom, outside of the normal re-frame state mgmt - haven't tried it myself but might be an option if you don't want to pollute re-frame's app state
@mccraigmccraig - I guess I am prepared to accept that, but it does feel icky. I suspect that I just need to get over myself š
@jarohen - Yes, I've seen stuff suggesting such approaches on the 'net, but I am concerned about getting tied up in knots if I am trying to manage state for the app as a whole and state for this view / component or another .
I think that I need to get over my misplaced negative feelings about the use of @app-state to maintain display/view/form-state as well as the actual app data-state.
again, not tried it, but I wonder whether there is room for a hybrid of global app-state + local atoms - thinking particularly about whether the lifecycle of that state is tied to the lifecycle of its component
i.e. if it is tied to the lifecycle of the component, having a local atom that gets created/disposed of with the component may be preferable; if it's not, then in the global app-state with you
app-data state can be in a different area of your app-db @maleghast - we have some areas which are just app-data and quite often objects taken straight from the api, and other areas which are view or form state, often with path, key or type refs to the app-data
some (few) times component-local state is unavoidable, but itās harder to inspect & debug, so i try to avoid it
Catching up here but can confirm that dvorak is awesome, and if I were eg. a journalist I think I would have stuck with it. For text it is far and away superior to qwerty, and far easier to learn as well. Some say that they worry that knowing two layouts will confuse them, but I never found that (human brains are great at contexts; people donāt forget their first language when learning to speak another one!) Keyboard shortcuts largely make no sense though. If the whole world was on Dvorak it would be better, but its a coordination problem - if you move, youāre on your own.
@mccraigmccraig - Yes, I think that I will approach it in that way; segregate things by using some top-level keys and putting view-state information in one branch of the tree and domain data in another.
although @peterwestmacott i found that, while learning a third language (norsk), i did forget my half-learned second language (french). it came back later, when i had gotten to fluency in norsk and didn't have to think about it anymore, but for a while whenever i wanted a french word i got a norsk word instead
perhaps itās not the best analogy then
Your experience is fully congruent with mine @peterwestmacott.
I notice a transparent context switch between my laptop and my ergodox. My arms are in a different position, and I sink into my other layout immediately. There's no confusion.
I want an Ergodox keyboard, really badly. There is a 5 week wait and I can't really__ afford one at the moment, so I am putting off my purchase, but I WILL have one...
Oh, hold on the message has gone away. When I looked last week they were saying 5 week wait.
I also want to wait and see if they are prepared to supply the keyboard with USB-C instead of USB-A plug...
@maleghast the connector on the keyboard is a micro-usb, so you just need any microusb->usb-c
That's a good point, I hadn't thought of that... Does that mean one can make the keyboard wireless with micro-usb bluetooth thingumy..?
I've emailed them to see if they will supply the keyboard with the right cable for me anyway - may as well ask.
Just to report back... Having added a "branch" to my app-state and thereby not polluted my app state and the functionality works really well š thanks all for assistance on this š I am trying to be less n00b
@maleghast those keyboards look yummie...
I would already, having barely tried one out, say you should... @dominicm will be happy, I am sure, to evangelise "properly" as he uses one... š
Pretty similar ETA to 5 weeks of ez ergo. Mine arrived 3 months ago and itās awesome
One of my workmates has just bought a sampler of all the different cherry mechanical switch types. He's planning on building his own keyboard
I am a gamer, I want http://www.corsair.com/en-gb/landing/k70-rgb š
I have the K65 with reds at home for gaming, high recommend. (might be a K60 actually, with no numpad or lights etc)
@guy itās beautifully made, really solid and the design is really nice for typing on
its less about that for me, but if you have a loud/louder keyboard other people can get a bit annoyed by it. If that makes sense?
Oh yeah, part of the reason I got browns at home and not blues is because my wife said if I went with the blues she'd beat me to death with it š
Also people waiting for ergodox, consider building your own, it's fun. Ergodox EZ looks super well built though.
Oh no... Now I've seen another shiny keyboard (i.e. http://keyboard.io)
I built my own ergodox, but I've not yet got round to using it. I wasn't doing myself any favours when I ordered keys without characters printed on them!
Best thing you can do is design your own layout from scratch, it'll sit in your head much much better then.
Put the keys where you think they should go, what makes sense for your workflow. This of course means dedicated open and close paren keys š
Why would you ever need a āclose parenā key? The editor does that for you.
Then I want the )
to be closed, yes, which it will be. But as my cursor reaches the first closing paren and I press the key, I want it to jump over it like a noop
The other reason I have, which is niche I guess, my emacs plugin uses parens as bindings to jump into the special paredit mode thing
https://github.com/Olical/dotfiles/blob/master/spacemacs/.spacemacs.d/layers/olical-lisp/packages.el
My keyboard config repo may be a useful base for people hacking their ergodox or whatever https://github.com/Olical/keyboards
Lol I always find it comical how the discussion proliferates whenever anyone starts talking about keyboards
Itās some very personal bikeshedding!
@mccraigmccraig youāre in good company
never found a mechanical keyboard to be noticeably easier to type in than other keyboards
Iām using one of these atm and loving it https://www.amazon.co.uk/Lenovo-Thinkpad-Compact-Keyboard-Trackpoint/dp/B00F3U4TQS
But I am horrendously notorious for hammering keys too hard and hurting my fingers/damaging the keyboard
And with a mechanical I can feel when it registers and find myself hitting the keys more softly
I prefer the feel and the layout + all the customisation. I wouldn't say I'm any faster or anything though.
So looking at the http://keyboard.io, I remember my dislikes about it: - The firmware seems hand-rolled instead of using ol' reliable tmk/qmk, there's less features as a result - I prefer blanks, I wish they had blanks as an option - I slightly prefer the thumb pads of the ergodox ez. Both look overall very good. The firmware is the main thing that would bias me to Ergodox though.
@minimal can the http://keyboard.io tilt & separate? Or are they mutally exclusive features?
itās arduino, you can do macros and fancy stuff but i havenāt done anything beyond change bindings yet
that looks really limited actually. I'm not surprised. But compared to the qmk featureset there's a huge gap.
QMK has things like leader keys which are like vim's, so basically you get chaining.
thatās the basic firmware, there is also https://github.com/keyboardio/Kaleidoscope which does a lot more but i havenāt tried it
Hahaha I could have placed a very safe bet that the keyboard discussion would still be going on when I checked back in on this channel š
The "into software space" communication seems interesting, but I'm skeptical of it being a good thing to rely on.
the noodlings that were me learning core.async, mult and reduce https://gist.github.com/otfrom/60b9f9fa7c3f345710aa894fca83771c