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is there a word (besides intersection) for 'intersection of two curves' ? perferably something shorter

Functional-Tom11:03:40 - new article on FW around Functors and Category Theory. If you like what you see, hit the rocket in the bottom right of your screen to show the author some love! 🚀🚀 🚀 (you can hit it up to 20 times depending on how much you think the blog post is taking off!)


are there any platforms out there that basically do saas payments? Not at the level of stripe, i mean, but like it has a page and maybe some templates and I can customize it and it connects to my api, which then connects to stripe. What I’m getting at is I’m a terrible UI person.


like i want the LaunchRock of payment stuff


Weirdest "other comments" I've seen so far from this year's survey results:


Also some fairly odd interesting ideas about what might be holding clj/s back. Fave so far: "It should move to GRAAL!"


I'm really surprised by the number of people who list "limited support for npm" as their primary complaint.


that doesn't seem crazy. that's essentially limited java support for clojure but on cljs


"support for maven"


Yeah, not saying the npm one is crazy, just surprised -- but I've never been much of an npm user. Definitely interesting seeing how many folks are coming from JS these days, with a very different set of expectations and preferences.


Seems natural to me that a lisp-to-javascript compiler is attracting a lot of javascript programmers and that those programmers would want access to one of the largest collection of libraries available.


I'm all for it :thumbsup: & thrilled to have a bigger influx of folks from JS! Just surprised, personally, that for quite a few people it was the #1 thing they would want -- I hadn't guessed that that would be a top priority.


Yea I can tell you from my perspective it was such a nightmare trying to port what I had over to clojurescript that I was literally 5 minutes away from quitting and never coming back. If @thheller hadn’t talked me off the ledge I’d be gone. And I don’t mean porting the code--that part was easy and fun. I mean getting my libraries to work.


"Why won't you take the npm poison pill?"

Alex Miller (Clojure team)19:03:34

(that’s the usual reason to avoid poison pills at least)

☠️ 4

well, it seems to be a high priority for language users though


I hope nashorn startup will improve: it’ll be cool scripting in cljs on nashorn 😉


but now clj is still even faster maybe


if you want to do serious scripting in cljs lumo, you’re going to end up with npm deps I think


we needed a calendar widget recently and were very thankful that someone else had slogged through that. being dismissive of npm is probably more hurtful to cljs than js


npm is just a package manager. you can get these libraries without npm as well through webjars


(which hides npm for you)


High priority, but perhaps advocating / leveraging an alternate, superior tool might alleviate that. Not sure how Yarn turned out, for example, but maybe that's a good alternative? As it stands, I'm very wary of simply holding to npm as even a pragmatic tool.


A failure of engineering, thorough testing (not run beforehand; not even sure it would have been caught then), communication, protocol (not following SemVer), and community, all in one.


And it's not the first time this has happened, and won't be the last.


yarn is great and it’s certainly what I use. given how complicated the npm module resolution algorithm is, I’d be a hell of a lot more wary of trying to make that stuff work manually and really don’t understand why you’d want to. the npm binary has bugs but it basically works and bugs get fixed


obviously that bug is really bad, but...


stuff has bugs


at least if it's a tool a ton of people are using you'll find out pretty quickly


It's more a combination: A. the scale of the bugs npm gets, B. the categories of bugs npm gets, C. the handling of issues in the npm community and by npm developers, D. the fundamentally flawed and immature policies and design of npm in tandem (see: left-pad and arbitrary revocation of public artifacts)


It is not a tool I would trust to be one of the major pillars of the development world as it is right now.


I thought npm deps got integrated last year, though. Am I mistaken?


But it's not really working


In what way?


Just from other people's experience, transitive dependencies and/or advanced compilation is not working.


Gotcha, thanks.


@eggsyntax Running behind the conversation here - but npm support for me would be pretty big, and native javascript packages. When I’m in javascript land, I’m breathing the fresh air of no java and no maven - a javascript tool that brings both of those back in is a setback.


like, in my fantasy world, getting started with clojurescript would look like this:

npm init my-cljs-project
npm i --save cljs
npm i --save somedependency
touch main.cljs
// edit main.cljs to declare the package, import somedependency
// edit package.json to define "start" as "node cljs.js main.cljs"
npm run start


@wmichaelshirk shadow-cljs isn’t far off from that


to the googles….


That looks great, @lee.justin.m I don’t know how I’ve missed this before.


drop by #shadow-cljs if you start using. @thheller is there and is very responsive to issues