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2022-09-21

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#clj-yaml
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2022-09-21
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borkdude10:09:04

@lee https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0IA3ZvCkRkQ! It looks like your PR was merged (and our hunch that starting with an issue + PR and not using many words was the right approach for this maintainer!)

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grzm11:09:00

And I needed some of those words to clarify what the actual narrow issue in this case actually was šŸ˜›

borkdude11:09:33

I think it all helped (except my blunt remarks at the start)

grzm11:09:13

pats @U04V15CAJ on the shoulder. YAML is infuriating/crazy-making.

lread11:09:25

Glad it worked out!

lread11:09:59

It really looked like something different at the start. And finding the root cause made the change make more sense.

lread12:09:56

Also thanks for the idea of how to approach submitting the PR/issue @U04V15CAJ, I think it really helped.

borkdude11:09:37

SnakeYAML is normally released twice a year: August and February
laughsob

grzm11:09:45

I can respect that. Helps pace the project, you know you get regular updates, keeps the maintainers on track while letting them work on other stuff too. I mean, would you want to worry about YAML 100% of the time?

borkdude11:09:24

Yeah but I think it makes sense to host our own fork meanwhile on Clojars

borkdude11:09:42

To undo the churn caused by those frequent updates hehe

borkdude11:09:25

Ah it seems we might be getting it sooner than expected :)

grzm11:09:07

Awesome sauce!

borkdude11:09:20

> I can respect that. Don't get me wrong, I respect that too, I was just lol-sobbing because we just missed the last release window

borkdude11:09:31

I wonder what the remaining issue is that Andrey is referring to

lread11:09:30

I don't know, hope he lets us know!

borkdude12:09:53

He replied and is on it. I'm starting to like this guy

lread12:09:14

He had me at YAML

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borkdude14:09:30

That is very kind of you. You rule!

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borkdude14:09:19

Btw, I've been wondering, is there a similar "datetime" problem with what gets emitted for 1.1 and read by 1.2?

lread14:09:03

Ya, Andrey hinted at thatā€¦ I wonder. So YAML 1.1 supports timestamps but YAML 1.2 does notā€¦

lread14:09:23

thatā€™s right, I think?

borkdude14:09:16

$ bb -e '(yaml/generate-string {:foo #inst "2022-09-09"})'
"{foo: !!timestamp '2022-09-09T00:00:00Z'}\n"

borkdude14:09:55

dunno what's up with this, but if nobody hits that problem, I guess it's fine

lread14:09:32

Also: 

āÆ bb -e '(yaml/parse-string "foo: 2022-09-09")'
#ordered/map ([:foo #inst "2022-09-09T00:00:00.000-00:00"])

lread14:09:48

Weird: 

āÆ bb -e '(yaml/parse-string "foo: 2022-40-40")'  
#ordered/map ([:foo #inst "2025-05-10T00:00:00.000-00:00"])

lread14:09:16

I guess we can address if something comes up.

borkdude14:09:26

if it looks like a date, it quacks like a date

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lread14:09:57

Itā€™s a date alright, but all quacked up.

borkdude14:09:51

at least a date string doesn't get emitted like an un-quoted thing, right? <insert meme of boy and girl where girl says "right?" second time and boy looks frustrated>

lread14:09:16

Ya was thinking same.

borkdude14:09:50

might be good to double check with 1.3.32

borkdude14:09:54

1.32 I mean

borkdude14:09:23

or wait, that was already in bb ;)

borkdude14:09:29

<confused/>

lread14:09:40

Blame one of the other borks.

lread14:09:54

Iā€™m a YAML newbie. Maybe @grzm can think of a yaml 1.1 vs 1.2 timestamp issue?

grzm14:09:08

I'm a YAML agnostic.

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grzm15:09:50

I didn't even know YAML attempted to do anything with timestamps. I also didn't know there were such crazy subtle gotchas between versions

borkdude15:09:37

but now you do right? so are you still an agnostic or do you BELIEVE THAT YAML HELL IS FOR REAL šŸ”„

grzm15:09:43

Pascalā€™s YAMLā€™s Wager?

borkdude15:09:13

I was thinking of that one too ;)

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borkdude15:09:31

It's like an index fund right

lread15:09:34

Wasnā€™t it Sartre that claimed Hell is YAML?

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borkdude15:09:50

Hell is other people's Clojure or just YAML in general

simple_smile 1
borkdude16:09:15

Btw folks, I was just making lame jokes, I hope I didn't offend anyone. I love other's people's clojure.

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grzm17:09:37

I love @lee ā€˜s Java, both because I think it was an elegant, concise solution and that I didn't have to write it :)

grzm17:09:47

And now I realize @U04V15CAJ ā€˜s projects are really just his way of making our Clojure is more like his šŸ˜œ

lread17:09:15

Thanks @grzm! It took me a some time to figure out where to inject my, uh, masterpiece. I used to write Java for a living. I almost forgot how!

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lread17:09:02

Yeah I think his edits are good, his naming is probably clearer. I was surprised he made so few changes. I was wondering if heā€™d be ok with that regex as I donā€™t think he uses regexes otherwise in that area of his code.

borkdude17:09:44

O wait. Snake... YAML.. šŸ‘æ

grzm17:09:04

It matched exactly what I was hoping to do, but hadn't yet done the research of where or whether it was feasible in the codebsse

grzm17:09:36

So, thanks :)

lread17:09:45

My pleasure!

borkdude17:09:54

I think the only thing left to do is wrap up your PR @grzm - by the time we finish that, Andrey will probably have published 1.33

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lread17:09:30

So is the snake in snakeyaml from the garden of eden @U04V15CAJ?

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grzm17:09:31

The codebsse is pretty logical from what I saw.

lread17:09:04

Yeah but so many types, eh?

grzm17:09:26

Yeah, but understandable. And it's Java

borkdude17:09:52

@lee Well, definitely not the garden of .edn :drum_with_drumsticks:

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lread17:09:06

Ooooo! Noice!

lread17:09:52

Yeah @grzm, the ā€œtypesā€ thing was just me trying to be witty! simple_smile I found my way around without too much difficulty.

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lread17:09:43

More people should join this channel, they would come for the YAML but stay for the excellent jokes.

grzm17:09:43

I thought YAML was the joke.

borkdude17:09:51

I couldn't help myself. I think I reached my lame joke climax today https://twitter.com/borkdude/status/1572643607324069888

borkdude17:09:03

I ask for forgiveness and hope tomorrow is a better day

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grzm17:09:05

Repent, and sin no more.

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borkdude18:09:05

One more idea though: a SnakeYAML PR which turns everything from camelCase to snake_case... Might be a good 1 April prank ;)

lread20:09:59

Yeah saw that, he seems to have taken quite a few hits of late and is shown to be generally trying to help out there!

borkdude20:09:28

Yeah, agreed

lread20:09:15

I mean it doesnā€™t take much negative energy for me to say, ā€œblech, maybe notā€, when trying to help out. Looks like he has some real tenacity.

lread20:09:15

I meanā€¦ likeā€¦ if we were really into YAML or somethingā€¦

borkdude20:09:28

I was just going to post that link and was going to say almost the exact same thing as you, but then I thought: ah well, lread has already done something similar, I guess ;)

lread20:09:42

I dunno about thatā€¦ but I think our solution (snakeyaml numberish PR) might be better for us at this point in timeā€¦ based on what we currently understandā€¦ or donā€™t understandā€¦

borkdude20:09:05

yes, as long as things just keep working and we can stay ignorant of any edge cases, this seems best

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borkdude20:09:27

in the comfortable dream world between YAML hell and EDN heaven

lread20:09:11

itā€™s trippyā€¦ I canā€™t feel my handsā€¦ where am I?

borkdude20:09:11

your hands are numb of whitespace indentation lread, take a break

lread21:09:00

beat me to it!

slipset15:09:34

@lee and @grzm I get a really warm, fuzzy feeling for how youā€™ve handled this issue vis a vis the SnakeYAML maintainer. I really feel youā€™ve represented the Clojure community in the best way possible!

grzm15:09:24

Thanks. I think the community does a great job of attracting great people and reinforcing great, productive behavior. I'm happy to be a part of it!

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lread15:09:41

Yeah, the Clojure community sets a good example. I reinforces treating others with equanimity and respect. Which seems like a simple thing, right? But maybe not so easy for everyone?

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