Alongside nginx, Postgres, ipfs and curl! That's some company.

Would storing this code inside of ChatGPT/Codex model count as a good thing or bad thing? Because they did this too... So I'm not sure who benefits from this code storage. I think they simply sell the idea that they'll preserve the code if you'll decide to not store it in github anymore. It's good training data so they want to keep it forever. And IMO this is actually an inferior thing to do. Do you know how I could remove my own code from there? I don't want it to be preserved.

nice! I wonder how they selected it. obviously not by number of stars since there's languages way more popular

They took everything that had at least one star throughout the year 2020 or similar.

yeah, but they mention clojure specifically among a short list of other projects

What are your top requirements? I primarily use Signal for the following reasons: pros: • sets standards for end2end encryption. possibly the best one out there • both server and client open source • good desktop client • decent video, audio calls, screen share • free to use • no state on their servers about your device/contacts etc cons: • device sync not too good • little to no cloud storage, specially compared to telegram • lesser userbase • needs a phone number to register and find others (not a big deal for me)

+1 on Signal. Although I use multiple messengers - different people reside in different places.

So I have just tried Signal for a bit, and realized that I would want to have seamless device sync, like with telegram - no matter what device I use - I have all of my messages there. To be honest - I pretty much like everything about telegram, except the fact that it has its servers in Russia, and I live in Ukraine, and we are at war with Russia.

How do you know the servers are in Russia?

> I would want to have seamless device sync yeah its a thing i miss in Signal from telegram too but I reconcile with the fact that since Signal's servers are quite stateless and have little to know info on you, its quite hard or impossible to do this. Telegram does it because of its pretty much non existent E2E encryption

I don't know for sure, but it seems to be the case.

But based on what? I can't find it quickly but IIRC quite some time ago Durov has said that he moved everything IT-related outside of Russia.

ive made peace with the fact that i can let go of a little bit of convenience if that means i get really good encryption 🙂

I would prefer convenience over encryption 😁

well signal might not be the one then. also not sure if anything's like tg in that matter. the fact that their crypto is both handrolled and opt-in, really puts me off

use their private message (the one with the real encryption), you can see its not any different from signal 🙂 the fact that people can read my stuff on the server worries me the most

there is https://delta.chat/en/ interesting concept, all messages are just encrypted email. basically messages are saved on mailing servers and if you use private hosting solution – you can be sure it is not in russia

@U2FRKM4TW it would be great if we could know for sure that it's true. And I just don't know. Also this tweet has some interesting screenshot. And Telegram team have actually responded in the thread: https://twitter.com/rkiyanchuk/status/1656879552055083009?t=nnDP5l2VhLA2QmAE5qX2uQ&s=35

Seems like that data on the screenshot is inaccurate

Wherever my friends are talking, so I have most of them installed.

yeah getting people into Signal is a chore. I too need to run Whatsapp on the side sometimes. Much better crypto than tg too 😛

> Telegram does it because of its pretty much non existent E2E encryption When you use telegram chats they create unencrypted chats by default and these chats are actually synced between devices. If you actually create encrypted chats then you can't sync them.

> I would prefer convenience over encryption 😁 Use Messenger. Good luck. Case closed. Edit: did you know that fb released llama language model? I thought I'll mention it here for no particular reason.

> If you actually create encrypted chats then you can't sync them. yes, it that case signal is actually better or even whatsapp. they all can sync E2E messages 😄

as an infra/SRE/security person myself, i get quite some nightmares thinking about tg's setup

I like signal because of their open nature and the signal foundation (and Meredith Whittaker in particular) seem to be people trying to do good in the world

Also the desktop app is nice and I use it for file transfers between phone and computer

Signal is great until you try to transfer chat history or delete and redownload the app. it's much more ephemeral than whatsapp or messenger or others. i love signal but forward secrecy is really annoying in practice

This convo has me wondering, without really doing research or thinking about the problem of chat apps, are there any e2e encrypted chat apps that just dump chat logs to the device's filesystem, unencrypted(keeping that concern separate) , leaving it up to the user to manage disk encryption and sync them with something like dropbox/syncthing/whatever?

I mean transferring chat history doesn't seem that hard in signal, but I've never done it

re signal: i tried transffering roughly 1.5 years of chats from an iphone 10 to an iphone 13 in december and after 3 hours of spinning at 99% complete (which was after multiple hours of processing the first 99%), i gave up. i didn't try again

ah, that sounds terrible

Yeah I just looked at that too, reinstalling the app to load chat logs is what I mean though, that seems convoluted for what is essentially a bunch of text logs. I get that is probably necessary if you want the chat app to manage the at rest encryption, but I'm wondering if there's something that keeps that separate and just dumps out text logs and uses those same logs to render the ui?

i should be clear that i pay $5 to signal to support it, i think it's the best in the "encrypted chats" space, but it's not remotely as seamless as whatsapp or fb messenger

I havent checked how it works exactly but it is open source so feel free to read through code here: https://github.com/signalapp

There is also Threema as one of the probably most secure e2e encrypted messengers. But its in the same space as Signal and thus has no simple multi device sync

@U052QUJDYB0 Keybase has been good to me

https://blog.zoom.us/zoom-acquires-keybase-and-announces-goal-of-developing-the-most-broadly-used-enterprise-end-to-end-encryption-offering/ then you might consider zoom :D

There's this one but OP asked for convenience over privacy. I think this is not what they expect to be suggested. https://github.com/simplex-chat/simplex-chat