Fork me on GitHub
Slack Archive

This page is not created by, affiliated with, or supported by Slack Technologies, Inc.

2021-05-03

Channels

#off-topic
<
2021-05-03
>
jmayaalv08:05:31

this is the clubhouse i like šŸ™‚

šŸ‘ 3
Grzegorz Smajdor09:05:03

I was confused for a moment

Drew Verlee15:05:52

"evil" definition 175. You allow customers to sign up automatically but require a "person to person" chat in order to cancel. Bonus evil, show a "sad puppy" that says it will miss you.

noisesmith15:05:41

"sad puppy" evil UI pattern makes me think of this classic

šŸ˜„ 3
noisesmith15:05:45

so many services don't let you cancel unless you talk to a "retention specialist" whose literal job is to prevent you from cancelling

noisesmith15:05:03

gyms for example are really bad about this

Stuart15:05:14

See, that's why I dont' join a gym.. Yeah, that's the reason...

noisesmith15:05:24

many have a business model that boils down to "guilt trip people into maintaining a membership, but make them feel awkward about actually showing up" - yay, more money, less crowding, a bunch of people who get their feelings about health and body image manipulated for profit

āœ”ļø 3
raspasov16:05:59

I agree about the guilt tripping. How do they make them feel awkward about showing up?

noisesmith16:05:26

by creating an environment that is as imposing as possible, some of the same tricks fast food places use to reduce the amount of time people spend in the dining room (same end: reduced crowding without lowering profit): harsh lighting, aggressive sound system settings, spaces that amplify all sounds to create a overwhelming chatter / din - various elements adding up to a feeling that you are awkward, exposed or vulnerable. basically the opposite of everything that makes a home or a library or pub a comfortable place

noisesmith16:05:09

it's hostile design but in architecture / interior design rather than UI

noisesmith17:05:15

from a systems perspective it's similar to the design of many public services / safety nets. the whole experience is designed to make you not want to be there or come back. when I became a professional in middle age (after half a lifetime of poverty) it blew my mind that there were institutions / bureaucracies that I would rely on that weren't designed to leave me feeling humiliated or undermined.

noisesmith17:05:55

the fact that we live with hostile anti-human systems and they are designed that way and could be implemented differently is a bit of a hobby-horse of mine :D

raspasov18:05:22

Hmmm, ok šŸ™‚ It can be an interesting psychology discussion, but Iā€™d be mostly speculating.

noisesmith15:05:42

apps use a variant on the same formula - giving you awkward questions or manipulative wording around the option to cancel / not sign up

noisesmith15:05:55

it's less powerful when it's not in person, but still evil

noisesmith15:05:54

instead of "sign up" and "close dialog" you get "I want to be a good person" and "I've given up on being decent"

Drew Verlee15:05:18

I would actually get a kick out of something so direct at this point. What broke my spirit was realizing The Economist was going to put me through the loop. I trusted them.

respatialized15:05:59

if any magazine knows the behavioral econ and game theory around that, it'd be them, no?

Drew Verlee15:05:38

This is why we all have trust issues.

Stuart15:05:43

Ifd its a service you pay for, can't you just ignore and remove the direct debit from your bank?

Drew Verlee15:05:53

sort of. Life time actually threatened to take legal action. I moved to Chicago and they said i had to show up in person. I talked them down to sending a letter.

Lennart Buit19:05:17

Slightly related: There is this notion of unpleasant design where designers use their wisdom to deter you from doing particular things. If you find that interesting, listen to https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/unpleasant-design-hostile-urban-architecture/

Lennart Buit19:05:04

You know the endless mazes of trying to reject cookies, thats a fairly evil instance of unpleasant design :ā€™).