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#off-topic
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2020-12-02
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paul.legato00:12:59

Slack CEO Stewart Butterfield:

"the opportunity we see together is massive … as software plays a more and more critical role in the performance of every organization, we share a vision of reduced complexity, increased power and flexibility, and ultimately a greater degree of alignment and organizational agility. Personally, I believe this is the most strategic combination in the history of software, and I can't wait to get going."
It seems he couldn’t quite figure out how to work the words “synergy” and “nimble” in there.

😂 3
Alex Miller (Clojure team)00:12:22

sounds like an ai wrote that :)

😆 3
Alex Miller (Clojure team)00:12:47

zoom has often been better in that calls usually worked

Jeff Evans00:12:52

Surely by now they have offered him a not-insubstantial sum for that handle

hipster coder02:12:44

any general opinions on using Clojure foreign function capability (interoperable) with Python, as well as Clojure Script?

hipster coder02:12:26

I am trying to think of the trade offs between directly calling foreign code… versus using a message broker like Kafka

Craig Brozefsky03:12:14

process boundaries are a fine place to build a stronger abstraction

Craig Brozefsky03:12:33

don't need kafka for that

Craig Brozefsky03:12:48

shell invocation, http, all kinds of ways to handle that, some of which are slower and simpler, some are faster.. some sync vs async

Craig Brozefsky03:12:04

in short, I think you will spend as much time trying to call a python runtime properly from JVM

Craig Brozefsky03:12:23

as you would building a cleaner interface between processes, or subprocesses

Craig Brozefsky03:12:58

I would never ship clojure in jvm calling python runtime BTW

Craig Brozefsky03:12:41

you have to go thru clojure -> java -> JNI -> Python runtime ...

Craig Brozefsky03:12:24

so many abstractions and translations, best to just output spit and slurp some JSON over a socket or stdin 8^)

seancorfield03:12:13

OTOH https://github.com/clj-python/libpython-clj is well-supported and fairly heavily used by the data science folks -- it's grown out of that community.

😁 3
seancorfield03:12:39

The same folks have just released a Julia/Clojure interop library BTW.

😁 3
seancorfield03:12:57

That said, I would probably only bother going across that sort of boundary if I had a lot of experience in both languages and there were some critical libraries I needed to use in the non-Clojure ecosystem 😐

Vincent Cantin04:12:11

https://adventofcode.com/ day 2 is starting in 10 min, time to warm a REPL.

🔥 15
hipster coder16:12:02

yes, I was looking at the new clojure-python lib… Sounds like I should only experiment with that… not on production… maybe just for fast AI/Data type experiments.

hipster coder16:12:35

I have used foreign functions on Ruby/Java… and yea… sometimes there’s a hiccup… 1 little incompatible call

noisesmith18:12:09

@timok fun / scary version: analyze interactions between managers and employees to train an AI middle manager :D

3
noisesmith18:12:59

criminal version: train a model to correlate slack activity and stock price of that company

😎 3
ghadi18:12:22

end to end encryption would be possible in a group messaging scenario, but transcript maintenance and search is in tension with those goals

ghadi18:12:11

Salesforce Slack will start doing the same stuff Microsoft was doing last week with the "engagement metrics"

ghadi18:12:56

the (global) security implications of Slack are terrifying to me without the Salesforce acquisiton

💯 9
Craig Brozefsky20:12:09

Irrational valuation of collaboration technology which is seen as table stakes for SalesForce to play

Craig Brozefsky20:12:47

in the "converged collab" space

Craig Brozefsky20:12:02

aka, docs, storage, wiki, internal resource mgmt, comms etc...

Craig Brozefsky20:12:32

maybe I'm just jaded watching middling exec teams try to buy their way into a story about the next big market trend

noisesmith20:12:36

given that collaborative tools become the source of truth about a company's workflows and internal knowledge, I don't think it's undervalued, perhaps just not exploited yet

noisesmith20:12:18

the "rational" thing would be to make it as cheap, simple, and flexible as possible, until it's impossible to migrate out of, then the terms are changed

noisesmith20:12:33

which sounds like something salesforce would do, to me

noisesmith20:12:21

at the startups where I've worked, I'd estimate that losing access to data in salesforce (not to mention the salesforce specific workflows) would be more disruptive than losing 3/4 of the sales team