Have there been any efforts to port Clojure to the Erlang BEAM VM? I’ve heard of Joxa, but it doesn’t look like it’s been updated in a while.

pupeno: Are they already paying a trunkloads of money?

alanforr: my product is a white label web application, our customers create an account and have people register into their own silo. When they do that, they have to enter the address where they live. They want Israel to not be in the list of countries there.

dottedmag: I don’t know, I doubt it otherwise someone would have told me, but I kept myself from looking at the size of the customer to see what my answer is assuming it’s a small one and whether it would change if it’s bigger than expected.

pupeno: I suppose US customers would want to remove North Korea, Sudan and Syria.

Or at least to prohibit signing up to avoid dealing with legal issues.

dottedmag: none of our US customers requested anything like that.

But yeah, it's pretty weird situation to be in.

I knew that in China they don’t like seeing Taiwan as a country and Israel doesn’t like Palestine and Palestine doesn’t like lack of Palestine and so on… but generally this came from countries not recognizing other countries. I’m not sure if the Emirates are claiming Israel doesn’t exist.

UAE doesn’t recognise the existence of the state of Israel according to Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel–United_Arab_Emirates_relations.

I will give what I think are some relevant considerations. I would say “no” for the first two reasons and only explain why if asked: you don’t owe them an explanation, and I doubt they would want one. I don’t know the full context of your decision, so I’m not saying that is definitely the decision you should make. (1) Dealing with people irrational enough to want such an exclusion sounds like a world of trouble to me. (2) The request itself is bad and I wouldn’t want to do it. (3) I don’t know how difficult it would be to make the change the customer is requesting, but that should also be considered.

isn’t the standard approach just to rename “Countries” to “Countries and Territories”? then no real technical changes have to be made

Perhaps there needs to be some kind of ridiculously-biased-country-list widget that will handle this use case. Feed it the target country, and it’ll spit out a ‘whitewashed' list of countries in a configuration that only exists in the world they’d like to live in. Can get the target country via geolocation or other means.

pupeno: can you show a different list to customers depending on the country their ip comes from?

Also: charge a “bigot/fascist fee”

ah just like what jeffmk said

max: yes.

ya so to play on what jeff is saying, tell them that it’s a lot of technical work but you’re willing to implement it for them for $$ and if they sign a 3 year contract. Then serve them up a “sanitized” list.

as far as they know, you’re going to lose a lot of opportunity, so it makes sense to have to pay for this...

I also run a white label application, and I don't think that this is an unreasonable request. Their government doesn't recognize another government. Almost every government has situations like this, probably including yours.

What is this business supposed to do about their government's position? I can't make the US recognize Transdneistria or Nagorno-Karabakh. These people can't make the UAE recognize Israel.

@bhagany: Touché. I think something like that could really be useful, though I presented it a bit tongue-in-cheek

No worries, just providing a counterpoint

You could really turn the idea up to 11 and probably make a business out of it. Visual mapping with disputed borders in favor of the target country. Russia/Ukraine. Japan/Russia. Sea of Japan vs. East Sea. On and on.

heh, that's not a bad idea. Google has to do this on steroids

My wife’s name suggestion: http://pander.ly

ha!

Does google do it now I wonder?

oh, yes, with maps

windows has had similar issues, too http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/archive/2003/08/22/54679.aspx

http://thenextweb.com/shareables/2014/06/24/see-how-google-maps-displays-disputed-territories-around-the-world/

Ahh this sounds familiar.

What a tricky problem

definitely a headache

Then you have international VPN/proxy issues, that are probably fairly difficult to solve (look at Accept-Language in addition to geolocation? What about expats in that country?). It’s really intractable to solve “perfectly"

yeah, I doubt perfect is on anyone's radar

@jeffmk: Easy. Require user to flash their passport on the webcam in order to access the application.

It just might work!

The Miller Principle strikes again! cc @alexmiller

Looking at CI services, any particular recommendations?

You could support your Clojure friends at CircleCI :)

There is also SemaphoreCI, which supported ClojureCup 2014

Circle CI is the current favorite

on that note, which was that service which is like newrelic but directly supports clojure (not just because it runs on the jvm)?

@onetom: Riemann?

onetom: what part of new relic?

@michaeldrogalis: thx, but not that one.

martinklepsch: apdex score primarily and drill down for slow web requests for example

and exceptions

there’s yeller which directly supports clojure, don’t know of one providing something like apdex though

maybe it was http://yellerapp.com/ ? 😕 but i remember something yellow on the page and it was emphasising their clojure support as a differentiator

Is there any good on-premises CI? Last time I checked it was either a deep enterprise with heavy $$, or do-it-all-yourself Jenkins / buildbot.

@dottedmag: we are considering http://nixos.org/hydra/ and moving towards NixOS in general. It feels like it's gonna be the future, but I don't have enough experience with it yet to really be able to recommend it.

@dotted mag there is also cloudbees

Contegix will do supported Jenkins type stuff too I think

@onetom: Interesting, thank you.

@alexmiller: Oh, Jenkins/Jenkins derivatives are so painful to work with.