Fork me on GitHub
#off-topic
<
2015-07-05
>
agile_geek07:07:02

Interesting survey on Clojure/Lisp use dropping off in data science (down 77% between 2013-2012). http://www.kdnuggets.com/2013/08/languages-for-analytics-data-mining-data-science.html Firstly, lumping Clojure and general Lisps together may have slanted things but either way doesn’t make good reading.

agile_geek07:07:58

Secondly, this is fairly old data. Clojure eco system has moved on (esp. tooling) so would be interesting to see where it is now.

agile_geek07:07:48

I wonder if it’s the ‘barrier to entry’ of having to learn Lisp semantics and/or FP. Although ‘R’ users and data scientists in general should be comfortable with functions?!

jwm14:07:02

yeah, I’ve kind of noticed what I see as another drowning out of lisp

jwm14:07:55

in media at least

jwm14:07:09

I think that what matters is github coding activity reports

jwm14:07:17

not polls though since those will be slanted by readers

jwm14:07:06

doesn’t show cljs though weirdly enough

jwm14:07:58

the important thing to realize I guess is that there are not enough people doing stats / experimenting with stats routinely enough to take any of them seriously heh

agile_geek14:07:14

I suspect that when ‘computer science’ biased data scientists look at Clojure they would find it interesting. Or ‘data wranglers’ which is probably how I describe my career!

cfleming14:07:26

agile_geek: I suspect that the data analysis tools in Clojure don't get the amount of love that scipy/torch etc do

cfleming15:07:03

agile_geek: Certainly I don't see a lot of people talking about them on the ML, although maybe there are specific MLs I don't subscribe to

iae15:07:54

QQ, has anybody heard of or tried to work thirty hour weeks instead of the regular fourty?

jwm15:07:39

I think most people try and succeed to work 30 instead of 40

jwm15:07:02

at least the people I work with heh

iae16:07:08

Yeah, but you're not allowed to clock out without staying for the 40 hours, at least that's what I see in the working field of Germany

iae16:07:32

But I think the thirty hour work week is the way of the future and am interested in how people managed to convince management as well as how it worked out for them

jwm16:07:08

I think what matters less is the hours

jwm16:07:12

and what matters more is the days

jwm16:07:15

4 day work week is a lot better than 5 day.. an extra 2 hours of work each day is hardly felt especially if you commute anyway and it typically helps with the commute

jwm16:07:43

I’d rather push for less days worked than less hours.. heck I am even for more hours

iae16:07:07

iirc you can choose to either work 5x6 hours or have a day off and one six-hour day

iae16:07:21

Although I'm not sure about that right now tbh

jwm16:07:27

6 hour day is already ruined hehe

sveri16:07:12

having kids I'd prefer to work less hours a day than less days per week

jwm16:07:16

I notice in 8 hour days management always takes their full hour even hour .15 lunches and so you only have 5.30 hours (first half hour of each day is booting computer, 15 minutes coming down from lunch, last half hour is shooting sh*t)

jwm16:07:28

yeah kids blow everything out of the water

ergl16:07:08

my experience with Clojure at the workplace in my area is that it is in the "trying to convince the boss" phase

ergl16:07:35

most of the startups here use Python anyway so they don't see the advantage of adding the JVM to their stack

jwm16:07:03

yeah I think that python is extremely popular and has a big foot in the door

jwm16:07:15

its extensively used in gov already

iae16:07:29

Of all languages, that surprises me

jwm16:07:27

I went to a meetup for php (don’t ask.. everyone threw php under the bus) and every single person that showed up was employed doing python

ergl16:07:44

there are some people doing small experiments in Clojure in startups, but most of the success stories I hear come, surprisingly, from big banks and Enterprise® business

iae16:07:50

That is surprising; what reasons do they cite?

ergl16:07:29

mostly, they already have the JVM as their core platform so it doesn't sound that scary to upper management

ergl16:07:11

also some of them use Spark so they are already using Scala and are used to functional programs

ergl16:07:25

I haven't been to meetups in a long time, so all this info comes from word to mouth speaking with CTO's at small startups and stuff

jwm17:07:02

well the lifeblood is in the libraries so hopefully clj/cljs continues on with great ones simple_smile

cfleming22:07:29

@iae: datomic is a gateway drug for banks, too