Clojurians Log v2

I think the nrepl console logging can be turned off as well

Do we need to enable the GitHub plugin in this channel? People can subscribe to issues on GitHub if they want to see those?

I guess not.

Either way is fine with me but some people may find it too noisy

When I added it I was still thinking we would be preparing the release a bit more than we did. 😃

Even then, I'm watching the repo so I'm now getting notified three times :)

The nrepl console logging is default off now. And there's a command for enabling it.

Do you see these messages?

Yes

Funny. But then you know 😃

Know what?

That I unsubscribed to github updates. But now I deleted the messages.

I think nrepl message logging enabledment should be a setting instead of commands. But commands were easiest, so will have to do for now.

Sure

Fantastic. Yes, these are the kinds of hopes I am having for the Scittle-related tool, so it is encouraging to hear that you think it is worth trying.

See below in the channel

This is huge, opening so many possibilities. I'll try this practice with the clay scittle tool during the weekend. 🙏

I committed the example here now: https://github.com/BetterThanTomorrow/joyride/blob/master/examples/.joyride/scripts/webview/example.cljs You can open the examples directory directly in vscode and then choose Joyride: run workspace script

@pez I intend to keep the examples directory structured and clean with easy to find examples which you can open in your editor (the playground directory seems a bit messy and seems to be for development?)

Yeah, I haven't moved my example from the playground because I'm not satisfied with it yet.

BTW. There's a debug launch target which opens up the dev extension host with the playground folder. In case you weren't aware. I should document that.

Your demo blows my mind, @borkdude!

Do you have a cat in the show?

Not this show. She's just flying up to Seattle on her own. Our cats cannot compete on days she is judging. We took our show cat to Las Vegas at the beginning of April (Jay judged Saturday morning, he competed Saturday afternoon and Sunday).

Awesome! What’s he look like? I’m curious now 😄

I wonder if we have any public photos of him...

https://photos.app.goo.gl/gZM2duvVjEPQmXDP6 -- not really a very good photo but it's recent 🙂

He's a retired stud cat at this point, but he was an international winning kitten and young adult about six years ago. Then he went off to Texas to breed, now he's back as an "alter" (neutered) pet/show cat 🙂

That's a much better photo of him as a youngster -- with his Supreme Grand Champion celebration cake.

(it's two different photos blended together)

Leopardcats Tao Tao of Bangles

Wow, he’s beautiful!

We’ve got a couple of kitties. A female muted tortie and a large long-haired male (I think a Maine Coon mix).

We used to breed as well as show -- all Bengals -- but we stopped breeding about 11 years ago now and so we have a mostly aged population left, including two girls that are over 19. Tao came from Germany originally (Leopardcats cattery, we're Bangles Bengals) as part of our agreement with a friend in Texas to show her cats, because she loved breeding but hated showing (and we loved showing but had stopped breeding).

We work with a couple of purebred rescue groups as well, fostering cats for rehoming -- so we get them from shelters and the rescue groups find new "forever homes" for them. We've fostered a couple of Savannahs and a Bengal so far, since the middle of last year.

Oh interesting. I’ve watched a doc on cat showing but that’s about as much as I know about it. That sounds like fun, and a good deed.

The fostering

Well, now we have a lot fewer cats of our own, we have space to foster others and still keep them all isolated from each other. We used to have to keep each intact (breeding) male in his own "space" and all of those spaces have freed up. And we have three big outdoor runs, fully-enclosed, attached to indoor facilities -- and everyone comes in at night (mostly to keep the noise down for our neighbors, since Bengals can be very loud and vocal).

Oh wow

They’ve got the life over there

They also have one of these to run on: https://onefastcat.com/products/cat-exercise-wheel?msclkid=ce8ddc71c74f11ec9ae1d9872d090fc7&variant=31140866523159 🙂

Oh nice. Got their own gym too. 😄

Do you mean, opposed to self-hosted CLJS or, why does it use SCI at all?

yeah instead of cljs

I have more experience with making scripting in CLJS work with SCI than self-hosted CLJS. SCI works with advanced compilation, making the extension quite small (200kb). SCI is pretty flexible and can be adapted to various environments, e.g. in #nbb it is used to create a scripting environment on Node.js with full support for ES6 modules. The startup time is better with SCI (because the JS bundle is much smaller). But feel free to give self-hosted a try and see what it yields, it would be pretty interesting to compare both approaches.

it wasn't a criticism I am far too ignorant for it to be that, more for my own education

thanks for your answer

Another thing is that macros are first class in SCI, they run similar to how Clojure on the JVM works, without limitations.

is clojurescript still limited in this way if you ship the bootstrapped compiler like you now can?

$ plk
ClojureScript 1.10.914
cljs.user=> (defmacro def-something [x] `(def ~x))
#'cljs.user/def-something
cljs.user=> (def-something my-var)
                           ^
WARNING: Use of undeclared Var cljs.user/my-var at line 1
(def nil)
cljs.user=> my-var
            ^
WARNING: Use of undeclared Var cljs.user/my-var at line 1
nil

self-hosted CLJS is designed to compile CLJS code within a JS environment, but that CLJS still has the same limitations as JVM-compiled CLJS

this blog post seems to imply that bootstrapped cljs can do macros, I'm slightly confused now: https://blog.fikesfarm.com/posts/2016-01-05-clojurescript-macros-calling-functions.html

It can do macros, but the way how you write macros is specific to CLJS.

E.g. the above macro I showed you has to live in .clj file to properly work for some reason

so bootstrapped cljs => first-class macros but now your code is boostrapped-cljs only, SCI => first-class macros + vanilla clj/cljs compatible code? (SCI subset of clj/s)?

sounds about right, but again I'm not an export on self-hosted CLJS. One thing that is better about it is performance since compiled code is generally more performant than interpreted.

LOL at the “not intentionally” part 😂

But it seems to have the command evaluate current block of code , which you can execute via Joyride.

Ah, interesting... and of course I could run a task, and nearly all my VS Code/Clover stuff is done via tasks (defined in Clover's config.cljs which also uses sci)...

Feels a bit inception-ish...

I think @mauricio.szabo is much closer to expose a proper API than we are with Calva. Since there already is a SCI API. But until you have an API, you can use the commands.

(vscode/commands.executeCommand "paredit.backwardUpSexp")

Check the contributions tab of Clover to see a list of its commands. You'll have to check the source code to know what arguments they accept, though.

I mostly have those overridden with tasks defined in my config.cljs but knowing I can invoke those tasks easily is useful. That also means I can use the task-based API for Clover to be able to send text from Joyride to Clover's Socket REPL 🙂

For example:

{
        "key": "ctrl+; shift+d",
        "command": "workbench.action.tasks.runTask",
        "args": "Clover: Tap def var"
    },

FYI: I think you should try to find another name than tasks describing these. Tasks has a specific meaning in VS Code.

Clover tasks or something. 😃

Not sure what you mean -- that is the API that Clover exposes to be able to run functions in config.cljs

That runs tap-def-var in config.cljs

Yeah, but when I have been checking out your config repo it has confused me a lot because I can't find any tasks there (I was looking for VS Code tasks).

Talk to @mauricio.szabo about that 🙂

The functions in config.cljs get exposed to VS Code as tasks -- hence the workbench.action.tasks.runTask command being invoked.

Haha, yeah, but you can help the reader of your config repo as well. Maybe just establish early what task refer to in the rest of the text.

They are dynamically added to VS Code as "tasks" as I understand it.

😛 The repo assumes folks are using Clover and have read that repo's docs 🙂

Oh, maybe they are. I don't see why they would be, though.

@pez tasks in Clover are LITERALLY VSCode tasks 😄

Roger!

TIL.

@mauricio.szabo Can I pass additional arguments to those tasks?

They need to be because it's the only API that VSCode offers that allows definition of custom commands and for these commands to have a keystroke

@seancorfield not right now, but I hope by next week you'll be able to 🙂

Or perhaps have Clover export the editor abstraction so it can be called from joyride?

(so joyride could call editor/eval-and-render, for example)

Hmmm, can you show an example of such a custom command, @mauricio.szabo? Could be something Joyride should be doing as well.

I need to study how, and if, VSCode tasks allow for custom commands. A second option could be to define a mutable var that I can export from Clover

> Or perhaps have Clover export the editor abstraction so it can be called from joyride? Yes, much better to expose this in the extension API.

@pez sure, look at the README: https://gitlab.com/clj-editors/clover#custom-commands. TL;DR; - Clover is customizable with SCI, so you can defn something with no arguments and it'll become a Clover task

Exporting that editor abstraction somehow would be super, super helpful...

(I know you had to expose it via that fancy p/let macro but...)

@seancorfield will look at it for sure! 👍

Calva will do so as well, but as I said before, we're not really close to being able to. Whereas Clover's API is already defined.

Also, Calva has a lot of commands. 😃

@mauricio.szabo I don't see anything on that page that couldn't be achieved by Clover having a command, say, clover.run and let users bind shortcuts to that. Like we do in Joyride with the joyride.runWorkspaceScript command. Here are my current bindings:

{
        "key": "cmd+f1",
        "command": "joyride.runWorkspaceScript",
        "args": "ignore_form.cljs"
    },
    {
        "key": "cmd+alt+,",
        "command": "joyride.runWorkspaceScript",
        "args": {
            "script": "ignore_form.cljs",
            "args": [
                1,
                2,
                3
            ]
        }
    },
    {
        "key": "cmd+alt+.",
        "command": "joyride.runWorkspaceScript"
    },

How do I run this "custom command" with the command pallete? Do I have to type the args?

(There's always the possibility that I didn't know about "args" params on keybindings too... 😄)

That's probably where the solutions differ... This binding of the command does not appear in the command palette. Only the last one will. On that one I haven't configured arguments, which will make Joyride pop up a menu with the scripts found.

When you say "I received that map as the argument when I tested it." -- how exactly are the arguments passed into the command script?

@mauricio.szabo keybindings for Clover tasks:

{
        "key": "ctrl+; shift+d",
        "command": "workbench.action.tasks.runTask",
        "args": "Clover: Tap def var"
    },

VS Code calls the command, which is a function in Joyride and passes whatever arguments are specified in args. In that experimental case, a JSON object. So if I catch it in the function and then press cmd+alt+, , and then inspect:

For now omnious soundtrack starts 😄

Well, that was why I added customization on Clover/Chlorine too 😄