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#clojure-uk
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2018-07-27
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dominicm06:07:04

oh yeah, morning 🙂

yogidevbear06:07:16

Haha, I was wondering why you hadn't said morning yet 🙂

dominicm06:07:59

I was distracted by the idea of hopping downstairs 😛

yogidevbear06:07:38

How's the foot this morning?

dominicm06:07:22

hurts less, but still stings. Moving around seems to trigger it, I guess I instinctively am trying to move my toes when walking about, which is causing pain.

Rachel Westmacott07:07:24

I think toes do a lot more than most people think, in terms of balancing.

guy08:07:26

sniff sniff i think 4clojure is dead

dominicm08:07:07

why do you think that @guy?

guy08:07:54

couple others on my team getting the same

guy08:07:00

oh its back up again

cddr09:07:19

Morning 🙂

agile_geek09:07:07

Don’t forget ppl if you fancy a tech conference at the end of the year that isn’t Clojure eXchange - http://bitrconf.org is pretty good value at £99+VAT for early bird tickets

agile_geek09:07:01

This ad was brought to you by geordies r us (promotional board of the Tyne and Wear area)

prnc09:07:00

Hullo everyone, intro time 🍉! I've been hanging out here for a little bit, time to step out of the shadow. I love the vibe here, people seem to be people--nice, friendly and knowledgable, so why not want participate 😜 Originally from Poland, last couple of years in London, representing Hackney. Studied Philosophy/Logic recently doing (sometimes creative) computering. Vim user, recent Spacemacs convert. Into music (trying to play guitar and learning about synthesis) and everything else 😉 Controversial: loving the weather in London this past month 😎 Recently in ❤️ with Clojure. Cheers!

👏 16
cddr09:07:39

> Controversial: loving the weather in London this past month This is controversial?

bronsa09:07:51

it's controversial to say it out loud, as far as I can tell the protocol is to love it secretly but vocally complain about it

prnc09:07:09

Well it's proving to be controversial already 😉 But I think this ^^^ is exactly right

cddr09:07:34

> love it secretly but vocally complain about it Of course. This is #clojure-uk. Makes perfect sense.

flefik09:07:00

> This is controversial? I would argue that yes, but it's too hot for a heated argument. 😄

8
3Jane09:07:29

it’s controversial if you live or work in a building with no airflow and no aircon 😄 I’ve been running on 5h of sleep for some time now, but otherwise the weather is awesome

4
3Jane09:07:34

(I am secretly comforted by the ritual of “if you’re new in any place in the UK, just talk about weather and everyone will accept you as one of theirs”)

flefik09:07:17

a colleague of mine is refusing to lower the inside temperature in the office because he is 'too cold'. it's currently set to 24.

flefik09:07:37

somehow i think it's more acceptable to wear another layer of clothing than it is for me to sit topless

3Jane09:07:27

I don’t know, you didn’t put up your photo on the profile.

flefik09:07:55

just a moment

flefik09:07:46

okay done

😂 8
3Jane09:07:41

Well then!

3Jane09:07:42

Your colleague is doing the work of God, do not interfere.

flefik09:07:11

(my profile picture may or may not be an accurate representation of me)

3Jane09:07:46

(that’s ok, neither is mine, we’re all safe here in the land of brackets 😛 )

flefik09:07:06

is that one of those personlised emoticons?

3Jane10:07:54

which one? O.o

3Jane10:07:19

Oh the profile picture, no, that’s a pasteup I took a photo of. https://www.instagram.com/silent_belle/ this artist 🙂

maleghast10:07:44

Morning All 🙂

👋 4
guy10:07:38

Morning!

maleghast10:07:06

I am trying to be motivated - I arrived home last night to discover that a Kickstarter reward that I backed over 2 years ago, that I AM VERY EXCITED ABOUT had been delivered and was on my sofa... I have unboxed, and now it is sitting, looking at me, saying "You want to read me and open all the things and not do any of that boring work"

guy10:07:26

Try doing some pomodoro technique

guy10:07:37

25 mins 2 min break x4 then play for a bit

maleghast10:07:51

Oh I see what you mean

maleghast10:07:54

I am familiar

guy10:07:06

yeah it forces u sorta to do some focused work and get some stuff done

guy10:07:16

then just keep track of ur time then start again after

agile_geek10:07:40

org-pomodoro in Emacs FTW

🍅 4
3Jane10:07:55

tell us what the kickstarter is, maybe it’ll work like getting an earworm out of your head

maleghast10:07:57

I worry that trying Pomodoro out for the first time today may lead to more breaks than productive bits...

guy10:07:10

if you do it correctly then no

maleghast10:07:23

@lady3janepl - Invisible Sun from Monte Cook Games - I have a Black Cube... (i.e. the full set)

guy10:07:34

25 mins with no distractions / no slack / phone / etc leads to quite focused work ive found

guy10:07:52

then in the 2 min break i jsut go get some water etc

guy10:07:56

come back and start again

3Jane10:07:07

oooooh shiny

guy10:07:15

i then do like 4 cycles then take a longer 15 min break usually

3Jane10:07:24

looks very Kult-like

guy10:07:34

I can only really manage like 8 cycles then my brains trashed, but it usually lunch by then

3Jane10:07:36

that is, DO POMODORO XD

3Jane10:07:59

You kinda have to figure out your daily energy cycle

3Jane10:07:23

There’s a “brainless period”, a “concentrated period” and a “thinking/decision period”

maleghast10:07:32

You see that black cube on the top of my shelves..?

3Jane10:07:43

and preload, or list ahead, tasks appropriate to each.

3Jane10:07:05

yes… oh hey numenera 😄

maleghast10:07:50

Oh yeah, I backed the Numenera Second Edition KS as well and that got delivered on the same day - well some of the rewards, I am waiting for a bunch more books from Numenera and Invisible Sun

3Jane10:07:36

I’m only buying pdfs these days, too many house moves, not enough time to dust books

maleghast10:07:50

OK, I am going to read up on Pomodoro ^^ and see if I can install org-pomodoro under SpaceMacs

3Jane10:07:17

( but let me know how the books are over the weekend 😄 )

maleghast10:07:18

@lady3janepl - I backed Invisible Sun just over 2 years ago, I back Numenera Second Ed about 18 months ago.

maleghast10:07:48

Since then I have adopted a similar rule, but there will be a bunch of books that have to be "grandfathered in" to my collection.

3Jane10:07:32

( tbf paper ones are much more impressive )

maleghast10:07:34

I also reserve the right to buy photography books and occasional rarities.

maleghast10:07:23

But I am going to make my wife's month and give away a load more of my fiction paperbacks in the next month or so.

maleghast10:07:45

It's going to cause me physical pain, but I will get over it.

bronsa10:07:21

you're going to forget about them in a couple of weeks, until next year you go search for one of them only to remember you gave it away and start hating yourself

bronsa10:07:27

totally not speaking from experience

flefik10:07:11

> There’s a “brainless period”, a “concentrated period” and a “thinking/decision period” There's a famous article about that from HBR. https://hbr.org/2007/10/manage-your-energy-not-your-time

3Jane10:07:09

Huh, haven’t read that one, thanks!

3Jane10:07:22

I stumbled onto the concept through a cheesily-named book, something something Productivity Ninja

3Jane10:07:38

@bronsa shhh I just had a large book clear-out, don’t remind me ><

3Jane10:07:21

(otoh coming back to old favourites I haven’t seen for 10 years was weird, some of them aren’t so good anymore. A case of meeting your childhood heroes?)

bronsa10:07:57

yeah I don't often re-read whole books for that reason

bronsa10:07:14

I love going back and finding paragraphs I loved/I'm thinking about tho

maleghast10:07:48

@bronsa - That may happen, but if it does I will buy the book in question on Kindle

maleghast11:07:12

Anyone got a good recommendation for "Getting Started with Org-Mode" or similar..? I need a whistle-stop, 30 minutes on how to use the m'f'er...

dominicm11:07:23

I think org is a solid week investment at least 😄

3Jane11:07:06

(if you want to do pomodoro)

3Jane11:07:41

you can also have slack “remind me” after hour. trying to get the best tools possible isn’t worth it with these things, cos the variety is distracting.

maleghast11:07:53

@dominicm I am not sure that I have a week to learn Org right now... 😞

maleghast11:07:27

The thing is on this computer, when doing work I do live in Emacs, so Org-Mode does make a LOT of sense...

maleghast11:07:39

I wish I could do Slack in Emacs...

flefik11:07:05

Slack used to have an irc api, i don't know if they still do?

dominicm11:07:56

I'm kidding, probably

maleghast11:07:24

OMG, Really!

maleghast11:07:48

I was just throwing it out there as "wouldn't it be great if"

maleghast11:07:04

@otfrom - Is this true and how much hassle is it..? (please)

dominicm11:07:16

his emacs config is open

maleghast11:07:44

On Github..?

maleghast12:07:27

Yeah, I found it - talk about over my head... 😉

maleghast12:07:04

I really don't have time to try and understand it, or shift to someone else's Emacs setup right now, so I am going to pin that to "later" 😉

maleghast12:07:36

I should drive over to Dundee and pay Bruce for some one on one time to get myself up to speed at some point - that's probably the way to do it...

prnc12:07:28

@maleghast re: org-mode it's quite easy (with some self discipline ;p) to learn org in layers to you just need to know that * begins a headline and indicates level and that you can open and close with TAB and you have a very basic but useful outliner other than that, I've got some notes from when I was learning: https://gist.github.com/qazwsxpawel/94d6fced878484e145e96c9a65183fa9

prnc12:07:47

caveat: might not be very clear cause I was making notes as I was going along (not intended to be public) and there might be some spacemacs specific stuff: keybindings with "leader" spc and local leader ,

prnc12:07:49

no worries

prnc12:07:41

the gist is an org file itself (export of a subtree from an org file) so you can check out the raw version as well

prnc12:07:11

here is another one with keybindings (again some will be spacemacs specific): https://gist.github.com/qazwsxpawel/6b95e7601b75f16d5943e2e4f4a09c5b

maleghast12:07:55

I am using Spacemacs but in HolyMode, so I am using oldskool key bindings in a lot of places... You've definitely got me up and running - I have two Org files now, and I am playing with TODO and nesting...

agile_geek13:07:50

@maleghast The basics of org mode don’t take long. Once you have TODO and scheduling you can add something like org-pomodoro on your TODO items

maleghast13:07:31

Yeah, I am afeared of the org-pomodoro; too much complication on top of already learning something new...

maleghast13:07:59

Also I get worried about installing new packages into my Emacs setup and then buggering something up and thereby screwing up my productivity (not that I have been very productive this morning if I am entirely honest), even though I know intellectually that all I have to do is copy my .emacs.d and move it out of the way and then if I do screw anything up all I have to do is blow away the broken one and bring back the backup... I realise that my brain and reality are not best friends very often...

maleghast13:07:48

I am so worried about upsetting the apple cart that I have not bothered to tweak my current setup so that I am always in Holy Mode and Paredit mode whenever I load a Clojure / ClojureScript file.

maleghast13:07:14

I am still putting up with the inconvenience of having to remember to set my modes when I start work...

bronsa13:07:08

git versioning your .emacs.d is a life saver

👍 8
maleghast13:07:26

In a similar issue to needing to learn Org-Mode I have magit and I am STILL not using it!

bronsa13:07:43

start today! you'll never go back :)

mario-star 4
maleghast13:07:54

@bronsa - Yes, I keep meaning to put my Emacs config into Git...

bronsa13:07:39

I even manage my emacs packages as git submodules -- it's a PITA when adding new packages as I have to resolve the transitive deps manually, but that means my emacs never breaks as everything is pinned and versione

maleghast13:07:10

Woah there nelly, you are not going to persuade me that doing anything with a Git Submodule is a good idea

😂 4
bronsa13:07:23

if a library has a breaking change I rollback to the previous working revision until I feel like spending some time updating

bronsa13:07:42

I think submodules are perfect for vendoring :)

maleghast13:07:07

I think (based on horrible nightmare experiences) that Git submodules are the work of Satan

cddr13:07:12

I'm having a problem trying to load a local mach extension... Given the context....

bash-3.2$ ls *.edn
Machfile.edn		deps.edn		dockerize.mach.edn
bash-3.2$

bash-3.2$ cat Machfile.edn
{
 mach/import [[dockerize {}]]

 }

bash-3.2$ cat dockerize.mach.edn
{

 hello (println "yolo")

 }
I'd expect mach dockerize/hello to produce "yolo". But instead mach cannot find the target.

maleghast13:07:28

@cddr - I wish I could help you there, but all you are managing to do is make me feel even more imposter syndrome as I have no idea WTF you are talking about...

cddr13:07:17

Ah sorry. It's in reference to juxt's "mach" project https://github.com/juxt/mach

maleghast13:07:32

Oh right, yeah, I have heard of that... In fact I think I have played with it in the past, and used it to do a walkthrough of a deployment test that Jon wanted to try out a few months ago, but it had been popped off my memory stack... 😉

maleghast13:07:39

(I found the repo and read the README)

maleghast13:07:55

I make jokes about the JavaScript ecosystem, but honestly Clojure / ClojureScript moves so bloody fast and I barely manage to keep up with any of it these days...

maleghast13:07:18

I am forever re-reading Github repo pages and thinking "I am sure I've read this before"

maleghast13:07:05

This may be directly a function of getting older, trying to do the work of four people by myself and commuting Scotland to London most weeks, or it might just be that I am not as good at any of this than I like to think I am... I'll let you work out which one keeps me awake at night and paralyses me with decision fatigue more often than not... 😉

cddr13:07:30

Aha, I just need to alias it in the import statement

maleghast13:07:46

Still having a TODO list in Org-Mode is bound to solve all of that...

cddr13:07:03

bash-3.2$ cat Machfile.edn
{
 mach/import [[dockerize {} :as dockerize]]

 }

maleghast13:07:31

Oh, right, that's nice and simple and kinda logical 🙂

maleghast13:07:46

Isn't it nice when things work the way you'd think that they ought to...?

cddr15:07:03

ok, another mach problem... (or at least mis-understanding of it on my part) It seems that within the context of an extension, you can't depend on a target defined in that extension. For example, given the extension file foo.mach.edn file:foo.mach.edn

{foo (println "foo")
 bar {depends [foo]
         update! (println "bar")}
I'd expect to be able to run mach foo/bar which would trigger foo/foo as a dependency but I actually get "Target dependency not found: foo"