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#clojure-uk
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2018-05-16
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dominicm06:05:09

oh sun, where have ye gone 😞

dominicm06:05:48

aws permissions are the worst

dominicm06:05:55

I cannot figure out why my lambda will not produce logs

dominicm06:05:04

that answer

dominicm06:05:08

fucking aws

dominicm07:05:27

unfortunately, that still did not work.

3Jane07:05:25

I wonder what engineers at amazon in aws teams feel about it

3Jane07:05:47

you know, do they all have shortcuts by now? every time I see terrible user interface / usability at a company, I wonder how/if they’re actually dogfooding

dotemacs08:05:01

Spoke to one guy who works at AWS at a Clojure Days conf and his experience matched that of a SRE from Google I spoke to about previously their use of their respective company tooling/services: they don’t get to play with the services/tools that are given to us, the end users. They get given old servers/tools for their own use. So they look at the offerings that are being given to the public at large with envy.

dominicm08:05:48

youch, theirs being worse, makes this worse.

thomas08:05:18

at my previous employee we worked on the cloud. no (or very little) difference with what the customer would use as far as I know.

peterwestmacott09:05:44

it amazes me how many hoops you need to jump through to make things work with AWS - the promise of services like Lambda are still nowhere near fulfilled

guy09:05:57

morning!

dominicm10:05:25

And terraform is suddenly unable to update the lambda code... no error, it thinks it succeeds, but the code doesn't change.

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kevin4210:05:05

I found that sometimes with lambda and terraform I had to wait a few minutes after the terraform had succeeded to get my latest function

kevin4210:05:55

do you use API Gateway for your lambdas?

maleghast10:05:48

@peterwestmacott - I am surprised to hear you say that. I'll admit that the workloads that I have used Lambda for have been simple, but my experience of it has been exemplary. Of course I've never tried to use it with Clojure, so perhaps there is a disconnect there. It's great for Python, and indeed building a service effectively effortlessly with Zappa was a revelation to me when I did it.

maleghast10:05:03

What's the pain point that you find with it?

maleghast10:05:44

(not trying to be a Troll or Devil's Advocate, btw, and I have zero stake in AWS, I am just genuinely curious)

dominicm10:05:49

oh, uh, I was updating prod's lambda, not staging 😳

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dominicm10:05:57

Just fiddling with alarms, not the end of the world.

dominicm10:05:51

https://github.com/awslabs/cloudwatch-logs-customize-alarms forked this to: a) send SNS messages as that's what we use for alarms b) have insightful information about stacktraces and exception messages.

dominicm10:05:34

there's probably room for open sourcing a tf module or something for handling common security things like user logged into console & so on

peterwestmacott10:05:30

@maleghast tbh I’ve not tried it that recently, but the fact that there is a gap for things like Zappa would seem to suggest that Amazon have a ‘last mile’ problem when it comes to making their products easily useable

peterwestmacott10:05:28

some kind of higher level service that give you logging and security and all the bits you need for a production web service out of the box would be nice

peterwestmacott10:05:34

(maybe I’m just too lazy)

maleghast10:05:49

I suppose so, but all Zappa does is automate the creation of API Gateway endpoints and Lambda deployments. I've done Lambda with nodeJS manually and it was not arduous 🙂

dominicm10:05:53

I had some issues with cloudformation and api gateway. Cloudformation won't re-deploy the gateway when the lambda updates, so you have to change something arbitrary to delete & create a whole new gateway deploy, rather annoying.

maleghast10:05:14

@dominicm - Yeah, I have come across that, and I agree it's not ideal now you come to remind me... I mean API Gateway is supposed to be disposable / repeatable, but I do see where you are coming from here.

dominicm10:05:34

Lambda hasn't yet highlighted a problem that needed solving for me. I'm still doing monoliths, so the overhead of asg isn't too much. If you're manually setting up microservices,t then I guess the asgs get tedious? But if you automate this stuff with CF or TF, then I don't see it.

thomas11:05:32

I love Zappa... Frank Zappa that is... 🎼 🎵

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dominicm11:05:12

auto-scaling groups

maleghast11:05:31

(oops, n00b moment)

dominicm11:05:07

hehe, it happens.

peterwestmacott12:05:34

AcronymWebServices

otfrom12:05:36

smash my forehead when someone comes up with another etla

thomas14:05:41

Three Letter Acronym

rhinocratic14:05:14

@dominicm Single Mode Fibre Waveguide?

otfrom14:05:34

I like ETLAs and XTLAs but nobody remembers the difference between enhanced and extended memory any more (incl me)

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dominicm14:05:10

@rhinocratic it's like smho tbfh, imdb.

rhinocratic14:05:12

Ah - thanks for clarifying that!

3Jane15:05:59

(Off-stage) : argh

rhinocratic15:05:25

Acronym Resolving General Heuristics, IIRC :face_with_rolling_eyes:

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otfrom15:05:22

technically acronyms have to be pronounceable

otfrom15:05:35

so scuba is but tla isn't

otfrom15:05:45

twain is my favourite

otfrom15:05:08

tla is actually a tli (three letter initialism)

thomas07:05:25

this means that TLA is not autological.

otfrom08:05:35

:mindblown:

3Jane16:05:38

Pronounceable by whom?

3Jane16:05:29

I can pronounce “Cthulhu”. Czech people are even more impressive, and Welsh probably summon demons every day by mispronouncing their town names.

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yogidevbear17:05:19

That would make for a very comical episode of Supernatural

sundarj18:05:09

'xkcd' was chosen to be unpronounceable but pretty sure i can pronounce it 'zuksud'

sundarj18:05:05

'sixth' on the other hand...

otfrom19:05:34

yeah, but it isn't a self contained underwater breathing apparatus tho

yogidevbear19:05:01

It's been a while since I've seen projectile in such a SPECTACULARLY VOLATILE display! Clean-up on isle B (for bathroom). My poor little human

yogidevbear19:05:18

I honestly thought he was passed the worst of it. Famous last words

otfrom19:05:40

is he a rocket or a Catherine Wheel?

yogidevbear20:05:46

Can I say both?