Clojurians Log v2

Looking forward to both of them

For the folks that went; any other talks I should watch out for?

I was on the first row to see it!

I haven't seen all of the talks but "Code was not the hard part" was good, also the "Sneaking in Clojure in video games" was great.

@pdekruif’s "Where did this div come from" talk was great, but I'm a bit biased since I helped him out ;)

Rich's talk was something you'd want to watch for 1.13 features. Stu's talk was a hot take.

@pdekruif's talk was brilliant! I really enjoyed Brendan Foote's talk about still choosing Clojure in the time of AI.

man I need a https://dragonball.fandom.com/wiki/Hyperbolic_Time_Chamber to watch everything

Oh yeah I was in Brendan's talk too. That was quite interesting

@lennart.buit Same... feels like that every time there's been a new Conj. Another conference which does this to me is FOSSDEM, mostly due to how massive it is.

@lennart.buit I missed quite a few talks despite being there, so I need such a chamber too

I am going to CSS Day every year… also a conference that doesn’t really have bad talks. Great for being there in person, not so great for watching it back.

I'm interested in the StardustDB one

I'm AI-leary, so I thoroughly enjoyed Stu's talk. And Rich's talks are always a thought-provoking delight. I also enjoyed the other talks very much!

So far it seems retired folks like Stu's talk (also retired) a lot... ;)

oei did Stu also retire

I'll give Stu's another watch when it is published but I felt it leaned too hard into emotion and soundbites—something to get a laugh and applause out of the audience. And several people felt it went way too political for a tech conference (esp. a Clojure conference). We'll see how more folks react once it is public. He's officially on sabbatical since August, but LinkedIn still shows him at Nubank right now.

(but I think it's sabbatical to use up vacation and retirement is coming?)

I mean, I think having 20+ years of dev time ahead of you or being mostly at the end of your career could change your perspective on this a bit. I've heard Stu was retiring but maybe it was just a rumor. He's not currently working anywhere.

LinkedIn also shows he's on sabbatical (as well as still at Nubank) but, yes, I think he's "about to retire". And I'm also "about to retire" (date unknown but likely next year).

Well deserved, I think, for Rich (for sure), Stu (pretty sure), you (also, quite sure). Just sad to see my programming heroes move out of the ‘field’ one by one

Rich has been much more active in the community since he retired. I have been doing OSS for around 35 and don't plan to stop just because my job stops 🙂

I don't exactly remember all the details of Stu's talk but I enjoyed it. I'll take his keynote over DHH's keynote at Railsworld any time of the day

Well, the less said about DHH, the better... 😉

I mean, it was almost the complete opposite, this is why I mentioned it, but that's all I'm going to mention about him ;)

you guys make me super curious haha. Even more jealous that I couldn’t listen in (although; I attended a Dutch Pink Floyd cover bands concert — that was also fun)

already 50+ comments about it on Reddit without anyone's seeing it except for those at the conj

Heh, glad you made that edit 🙂

> I attended a Dutch Pink Floyd cover bands concert Lovely! Which cover band was it? (let's keep this to 2 comments to scope this tangent)

In The Flesh? The Dutch Pink Floyd. Can recommend!

I feel bad for this guy getting downvoted hard just because he didn't like Stu's talk: https://www.reddit.com/r/Clojure/comments/1wwav8e/comment/pdlr6dd/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button

Yeah, I'm no longer a cog competing in the capitalist machine. I realize that this luxury biases me greatly.

One thing that I've heard Rich say over and over again, inside and also in the hallway track/afterparty: no closed map assumptions in Clojure. Don't misuse :excess to throw errors ;)

Sounds like he means it! 🙂

I haven't heard you ask for those new ... what did Rich call 'em, for clj-kondo yet

Well, Alpha 8 breaks the tests for one of our apps, so I can't add those directives to any code that is shared with that app right now.

We have Alpha 8 in production for our main API app tho' (and Alpha 8 in QA for all the other apps except that one that has to stay on Alpha 7 for now).

Somewhat ironically, I could replace the library that Alpha 8 breaks with a bunch of destructuring with :missing and :select but the library is used pretty extensively and I don't want to change that much code when it's fairly certain that Alpha 9 will fix things.

how many alphas did previous clojure versions have? 9 feels like a new record maybe?

Nah, 1.9 had loads more.

ah, the clojure.spec one

1.12 had 12 alphas, 2 betas, 2 rcs.

1.10 had 9. 1.9 had 20!!!

https://clojure.org/releases/devchangelog for reference.

I wrote this on the conj Discord re "don't reject": > For "don't reject" I'm assuming at some interface edges, it is a kindness to do so? For example, in a command-line interface, we would be being kind to the user to reject --some-mistyped-opt foo? > I'm thinking more of an unrecognized thing. The user accidentally specified maybe --farce instead of --force.

Yeah, I think that when parsing CLI arguments into Clojure data, it's reasonable to reject the request for "unparsable" arguments. There are similar edges already: writing to a SQL database will fail if you provide columns in SQL that the DB does not expect so you can either :select and ignore :excess, or explicitly check :excess in this case, or let the DB op fail and handle that.