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2024-04-11
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agigao06:04:04

Morning ☀️ After 8 months of Groovy/Grails I'm back to Clojure project :face_holding_back_tears:

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teodorlu06:04:05

Welcome back! 😊

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teodorlu06:04:11

Also, good morning!

agigao06:04:25

Thank you! It feels like coming home 😅

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agigao06:04:18

No longer have to deal with 500 line-long methods 🙈

Ludger Solbach06:04:20

Morning and welcome back! 😄

teodorlu06:04:35

> No longer have to deal with 500 line-long methods 🙈 I feel you! I can’t shake this feeling of having to do all these … “ritualistic movements” when working in certain other languages. A problem should have a seven line solution (a function), yet, it takes … types, methods, and … mutability 💥

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plexus06:04:47

morning and congrats!

schmalz07:04:09

Morning all.

teodorlu07:04:36

I re-read https://lambdaisland.com/blog/2019-08-07-advice-to-younger-self by Plexus yesterday. It’s a text that has put the focus on something important that I feel can be lacking in technology organizations. Super-brief recap: • Do: Become allergic to The Churn ◦ The Churn is losing a day debugging because a transitive dependency changed a function signature. The Churn is spending a week just to get a project you wrote a year ago to even run. The Churn is rewriting your front-end because a shiny new thing came around. ◦ Examples of churn-robust technology: Clojure, Common Lisp, HTML, Make ◦ Examples of churn-sensitive technology: JavaScript, Ruby, React-Preact-Vue-Angular-… • Do: study the great traditions ◦ The combined effort and experience that has gone into creating each of these traditions is measured in millenia. These people know things. They have seen things. And when you scratch away the hipster veneer of your technology stack you will find they are everywhere. ◦ If possible find a mentor, someone to be your shifu and teach you these ancient arts. Stay humble, and let your curiosity guide you. ◦ Examples of great traditions: UNIX, LISP, The Web, Emacs, TeX

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Ben Sless08:04:25

> study the great traditions That applies not just to technology 🙂

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borkdude08:04:51

traddev

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Ben Sless08:04:59

That's the original McCarthy paper on the scroll

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plexus09:04:23

Happy to see people still revisit that post!

teodorlu10:04:05

I’m happy that you wrote it 🙂

teodorlu14:04:26

> That applies not just to technology 🙂 That got me thinking about which non-tech-traditions I’m missing out on. :thinking_face:

Ben Sless14:04:04

Food, dress, literature, music, poetry, manners

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Ben Sless14:04:30

That's before we get into the real deep stuff of life styles and social organizations

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teodorlu15:04:18

Food, dress, literature, music, poetry and manners make more sense to me than life styles and social organizations. Care to give an example of an example of a great tradition in life style or social organization?

borkdude15:04:57

Philosophy and religion yield lifestyles, they don't grow in isolation probably

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Ben Sless15:04:19

Somewhat arbitrary example, not out of interest in the debate but because I see the issue come up once in a while - what if the alternative to the unions debate (false dichotomy?) is guilds?

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Ben Sless15:04:18

Or vocations as a framework for becoming a better person

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borkdude15:04:15

you mean like... writing artisanal ruby instead smashing AI generated Cobol at the computer?

Ben Sless15:04:06

Yes, exactly the opposite direction of where the industry is going 😄

Ben Sless15:04:08

I want an order of monks who program in scheme

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borkdude15:04:06

We could retreat into the mountains and build a Clojure monastery, no AI/copilot crap allowed

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Ben Sless15:04:35

Clojure is too practical for a monastery, but I like the way you're thinking

borkdude15:04:31

Monasteries usually have very practical stuff to do, to earn a basic living (if they are not entirely self-sufficient, and if they are, you still have to do very practical stuff to be self-sufficient)

borkdude15:04:52

brewing beer is one common example

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Ben Sless15:04:37

I guess you're right. They were important economic units in their areas, too

teodorlu15:04:00

Clojure and beer brewing in a monastery sounds like a surprisingly attractive occupation 😄

Ben Sless15:04:38

Clojure + playing music

Ben Sless15:04:00

Wonder if there's a higher incidence of musicians in Clojure than in other languages

borkdude15:04:20

I've picked up piano playing again since beginning of this year

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teodorlu15:04:15

> higher incidence of musicians in Clojure than in other languages My impression is yes, definitely

Ben Sless15:04:22

I need to fix my bass guitar, a screw broke

plexus08:04:50

Anecdotally there is a surprisingly big overlap between programmers, musicians, and jugglers

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ray07:04:23

Good morning. Got this the other day. Let's have an Amusing Caption:thread:

ray07:04:50

My answer to the challenge: "visualise your work"

thomas09:04:58

Turn left, go green!

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Ed09:04:23

Morning