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#clojure-europe
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2021-06-26
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dominicm08:06:12

Morning šŸ™‚

borkdude08:06:04

@otfrom is this the Clojure equivalent of ā€œfinally got my sound card working on linuxā€? :satisfied:

otfrom08:06:15

If I buy Linux hardware the way I buy Mac hardware then I don't have that problem.

borkdude08:06:31

What way is that?

otfrom08:06:51

I just check that things are compatible

dominicm08:06:14

I can't remember the last time I had hardware problems with Linux tbh, seems like a thing of the past.

borkdude08:06:57

I had a video card issue but it works beautifully in WSL2 šŸ‘æ

dominicm08:06:29

Oh that's true, Nvidia+video cards is a bit balls. I do buy AMD because of that.

borkdude08:06:05

Eventually I got it working though

pez09:06:09

Morning!

otfrom09:06:57

I look at the pain my wife goes through on her work Windows machine and count my lucky stars

borkdude09:06:27

what would be a nice, relatively light, linux compatible and very performant laptop with 64gb of memory in 2021? I'm waiting for the new 16" macbook pros + m1(x) processors to appear, but I'm keeping an eye on alternatives too. not buying right now, just looking.

dominicm09:06:06

64gb of memory? What are you doing? Running slack and spotify?!

6
otfrom09:06:35

What size?

borkdude09:06:06

I've upgraded laptops 3 times in the last 4 years for work, because one component is very memory hungry. Also GraalVM is faster if you give it more memory.

otfrom09:06:21

I've been finding recent Macs developer antagonistic lately

dominicm09:06:17

Dell XPS 15 is what comes to mind @borkdude. I don't think they ship with Linux, but I've known many people use them happily with Linux.

dominicm09:06:39

Have you considered buying a desktop? šŸ˜„

borkdude09:06:49

I have a desktop with 128GB and Ryzen processor

borkdude09:06:10

but I find myself working on my laptop more just because I like to sit around the house in different spots

solf09:06:12

ThinkPad is always my go to for Linux laptop. They get worse over time, but the keyboard is still the best

borkdude09:06:05

I do use the desktop for heavy duty work in the background

dominicm09:06:15

@borkdude that was my next suggestion šŸ˜„

borkdude09:06:50

I've tried all kinds of "remote REPL" stuff, RDP, etc, but there's just always that network in the middle

borkdude09:06:00

which doesn't make it as convenient as working directly on the machine

dominicm09:06:13

Is the RDP latency that bad? Or some other problem?

borkdude09:06:36

it's doable

borkdude09:06:31

but it's just more convenient to have everything on the same machine. e.g also when traveling

borkdude09:06:00

(what's traveling again btw?)

borkdude09:06:05

I'm getting my second jab today...

ā¤ļø 6
borkdude09:06:20

last time I almost passed out, hopefully it's better today ;)

ā¤ļø 12
otfrom09:06:27

Dell precision 7550 can come with Ubuntu pre installed and does 64gb

otfrom09:06:06

And is 15"

borkdude09:06:33

@otfrom wow it even has 96gb mem

dominicm09:06:44

@borkdude Yeah if you travel a lot then I get it šŸ™‚

otfrom09:06:32

All the gbs

dominicm10:06:43

You can always just use http://downloadmoreram.com ofc

pez10:06:05

Anyone know of a way to syntax highlight code to SVG? I can only find very cumbersome ways to do it.

āŒ 3
pez12:06:56

This was cumbersome to do the manual way, I tell ya.

RAMart10:06:32

Next :clojureD 2021 talk byĀ Nicole RauchĀ now online: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ulbfjwh45Y

RAMart10:06:45

This is also the last :clojureD 2021 talk that @martinklepsch has hosted and I would like to take the opportunity to thank you, Martin, for all your work and support for the conference for so many years! šŸ’ I roll in the dust before you, screaming "Thank you so much!" while raising glasses. šŸ» (All at the same time and leaving quit a mess, but I'll clean that up later.)

šŸ™ 12
ā¤ļø 18
borkdude10:06:26

Funny enough the precision, with similar memory, ssd and CPU config, is almost equally expensive to the Macbook Pro 2019 I bought, which has similar specs but a much better screen and trackpad (admitted, the keyboard sucks, but it hasn't given me any problems so far)

RAMart10:06:52

> the keyboard sucks "You're holding it wrong!" šŸ˜‚

borkdude10:06:58

I mean the mac 2019 keyboard

mpenet11:06:17

It's super heavy tho

mpenet11:06:25

And quite large

mpenet11:06:33

My wife has a 16inch mbp, we hate having to carry that monster when traveling

mpenet11:06:50

The power adapter is also heavy

borkdude11:06:26

which one is super heavy? I don't have the 16", I have the 15" 2019, with the still sucky keyboard. it's 1.85kg

mpenet11:06:07

I9 16inch, it's over 2kg i think

borkdude11:06:08

yeah for traveling I usually take a macbook air (1.35kg)

borkdude11:06:18

yeah that one is 2.05kg or so

mpenet11:06:44

My xps is 1.2 with a tiny adapter that i can also use for everything else (phone headphones etc)

borkdude11:06:21

16gb mem or so?

mpenet11:06:44

It's not the most recent

mpenet11:06:52

I think 2019

borkdude11:06:57

that's about what I'm getting with the new macbook air too with super battery performance... it's quite attractive for traveling...

borkdude11:06:13

but probably more expensive too

mpenet11:06:44

Yeah same, I don't think I ever ran out of battery after a full day's work on battery

borkdude11:06:04

oh really, that sounds good

borkdude11:06:19

(are you still talking about the xps 13?)

mpenet11:06:32

I have the fhd non touch version as a personal laptop, it's even better on this one

mpenet11:06:22

But the screen is not as good as the work machine, but it's semi-mate

mpenet11:06:46

Anyway, it's all about trade offs

mpenet11:06:05

My wifes mbp screen is gorgeous

mpenet11:06:29

I think if cpu/ram becomes a bottleneck you might as well offload that to a vm somewhere

borkdude11:06:23

yeah, I have a huge desktop computer for the heavy work

mpenet11:06:59

Similar, I can spin a monster vm with up to 225GB of ram for free'ish potentially. Never had to do it

borkdude11:06:44

because you're at exoscale right

mpenet11:06:34

I would love to dumb down even more the Client (laptop) and run everything on the cloud really. Even if I wasn't workin for exo. That's somewhat imaginable with the phones/connectivity we have now

mpenet11:06:54

The only downside would be in planes, but I hate working in planes.

borkdude11:06:47

Oh I just noticed I could get 1000 euros of the Precision machine by selecting a lesser video card. I'm not playing games on this thing anyway

borkdude11:06:37

@U050SC7SV well, I have tried such a setup with the huge desktop I have while working remotely on it from coffee bars, etc on my laptop

borkdude11:06:50

it works, but it's not perfect

borkdude11:06:14

I mean, there's always a certain delay no matter what

mpenet11:06:41

For some things it's ok. I d be ok with a delay on my repl, but not on general editing responsiveness

borkdude11:06:34

@U050SC7SV btw, if you're interested, you could try: https://twitter.com/joel_kuiper/status/1407097109539663874 :) but exoscale is probably a better deal for you

agigao19:06:40

Upgraded from 15" clunky keyboard MBP to 13" M1 and Apple has really solved some serious issues. Well keyboard, it feels good to write on a laptop again. šŸ˜„ Battery life is quite good as well, after 8 hours of work itā€™s usually 40%. Havenā€™t experienced any issues I thought Iā€™d have, considering M1 is ARM. One thing I still havenā€™t got used to after 9 years of 15" MBPs is 13.3 inch screen, itā€™s damn small : ( but carrying the laptop around is much more convenient. M1 has HiDPI scaling issues w/2k displays. In the countryside house, I have 2K dell and had to deal with this issue. @reefersleep since 2018 Iā€™ve been moving back and forth between city apartment and the country house (1800m altitude, Caucasian mountains, the Khada Valley). I can say Iā€™m feeling much better in the country, physically and psychologically. Especially in Summer when Tbilisi is hit by 35+ C, but in Winter we get 2+ meters of snow and 7 km long road is yet to be built in a contemporary fashion. I use 4x4 SUV w/good ground clearance to move around. Major upsides of the country - fresh air, no noise, natural spring water, beautiful habitat, mountains aroundā€¦ Downsides: the closest grocery store/pharmacy is about 30-40 kms away. Restaurants/cafes are about 40-50%, in some cases 100-150% more expensive in a nearby towns/resorts, aimed at tourists. I drive to the city twice a month to groceries. We basically need to bake a bread, cook everyday etc. And peopleā€¦ itā€™s a different kind of relationship among locals compared to the city, close and unconditional. Sometimes it might get in the way of work to have guests during the day, but itā€™s still manageable.

reefersleep11:06:43

@U2HBNQQBE I doubt I could even live as remote as you do in Denmark! My ā€œin the countryā€ vision is much more lightweight than what youā€™re experiencing.

reefersleep11:06:05

I imagine being 1 km šŸ™ from the nearest neighbour or something like that. Could be closer, too. The important bit is being free from other humansā€™ noise, and being able to be as noisy as we want ourselves (the latter being less important šŸ™‚, but still)

reefersleep11:06:13

Green surroundings would be great, too.

reefersleep11:06:56

Apart from actually finding a suitable place, I imagine our lack of handyness being the biggest obstacle. Weā€™re both keyboard jockeys, not wrench wranglers.

borkdude12:06:17

same here :)

reefersleep12:06:33

You want to move out, too?

borkdude12:06:47

no I mean, I'm not a handyman, more a computer man ;)

reefersleep12:06:15

@U2HBNQQBE sounds like itā€™s really good for you, even with the challenges accounted for šŸ™‚

reefersleep12:06:00

@borkdude how about the wife? We both regret not having learned more handy stuff yet, and not having partnered up with a practical person šŸ˜…

borkdude12:06:54

hehe. well, if I really must I can do some stuff, but I'd rather let it handle by someone professional if it has to look good

borkdude12:06:12

we live an apartment and have very little to care about, luckily

borkdude12:06:25

but naturally you don't get the benefits from a garden, etc

borkdude12:06:32

we just go into the city's park or sit on some terrace if it's sunny outside (like today)

borkdude12:06:48

so we have a free garden experience without the actual work of it :P

šŸ˜Ž 3
reefersleep12:06:52

I got tired of living in apartments some years ago, actually, but we didnā€™t get around to moving to a house before this year.

borkdude12:06:48

we stayed in my parent's house while they were on vacation last year for a week

borkdude12:06:03

I continually lost where I kept my stuff because the house was so big (much bigger than our apartment)

reefersleep12:06:05

Itā€™s weird how preferences change. I mean, itā€™s logical, from how your experiences impact you, but going through the change yourself is kind of odd. My parents live 2km from the nearest neighbour and 5 km from the center of the shitty town where I went to school. I thought it sucked back then, but now Iā€™m kind of envious.

borkdude12:06:46

yeah, when I was 18 I was glad I could leave the shitty town of my parents and to be honest, didn't look back ever since

reefersleep12:06:52

We just visited them yesterday, and they have huge forests, fields and lots of trees in their gigantic garden, all surrounding them.

borkdude12:06:03

whenever I'm back there I wonder: how could I have lived here for so long, it's such a boring town

reefersleep12:06:11

When I used to work in the supermarket in the shitty town, I sometimes talked to a talkative, cool guy. And once, he said ā€œI bet youā€™re wondering why I moved here.ā€ I canā€™t remember what he answered, but Iā€™m still wondering. Whyyyyyyy would you move there.

reefersleep12:06:04

Still, Iā€™m aiming to move to a house outside of what I expect to be an equally shitty place. I mean, Iā€™d love for it to be better, but odds are itā€™ll be small and boring, that kind of comes with the distance and quiet that Iā€™m aiming for.

reefersleep18:06:17

Footieā€™s on here. The Danes are going up or something. I donā€™t mind or care, except people are being loud about it šŸ˜ž Looking forward to move to the country eventually.

reefersleep18:06:02

Any country dwellers here? How are you finding it?

gklijs18:06:44

About the laptop thing. I'm working for a consulting company, if wfh stays as normal as it is, might opt for 'company desktops', you could build a really nice one for 3000 euro (roughly the price of MacBook pros). But if you occasionally do need to visit clients it's becomes a problem through.

borkdude19:06:04

just buy an extra macbook air 16gb for client visits?

agigao19:06:40

Upgraded from 15" clunky keyboard MBP to 13" M1 and Apple has really solved some serious issues. Well keyboard, it feels good to write on a laptop again. šŸ˜„ Battery life is quite good as well, after 8 hours of work itā€™s usually 40%. Havenā€™t experienced any issues I thought Iā€™d have, considering M1 is ARM. One thing I still havenā€™t got used to after 9 years of 15" MBPs is 13.3 inch screen, itā€™s damn small : ( but carrying the laptop around is much more convenient. M1 has HiDPI scaling issues w/2k displays. In the countryside house, I have 2K dell and had to deal with this issue. @reefersleep since 2018 Iā€™ve been moving back and forth between city apartment and the country house (1800m altitude, Caucasian mountains, the Khada Valley). I can say Iā€™m feeling much better in the country, physically and psychologically. Especially in Summer when Tbilisi is hit by 35+ C, but in Winter we get 2+ meters of snow and 7 km long road is yet to be built in a contemporary fashion. I use 4x4 SUV w/good ground clearance to move around. Major upsides of the country - fresh air, no noise, natural spring water, beautiful habitat, mountains aroundā€¦ Downsides: the closest grocery store/pharmacy is about 30-40 kms away. Restaurants/cafes are about 40-50%, in some cases 100-150% more expensive in a nearby towns/resorts, aimed at tourists. I drive to the city twice a month to groceries. We basically need to bake a bread, cook everyday etc. And peopleā€¦ itā€™s a different kind of relationship among locals compared to the city, close and unconditional. Sometimes it might get in the way of work to have guests during the day, but itā€™s still manageable.