morning, i have this faint memory (maybe was just dreaming about it?!) that there was some talk/plans already to integrate kaocha with cider? can anyone point me to a blog post, github issue or the like? (posted this in #kaocha too)

We might have discussed this, but certainly no work has been done in this direction.

Unfortunately the list of our ideas greatly outpaces our ability to deliver upon them. 😄

indeed. that said would love some feedback on https://github.com/clojure-emacs/refactor-nrepl/issues/195#issuecomment-482895570

not sure if this is worthy to work on anymore… or if this is the right direction even.. anyways… may just give this a proper a go to see where it leads…

@benedek Looking at clj-kondo, I’ve been thinking it’d be much easier (and way more portable) to just use rewrite-clj to generate the AST.

It won’t be as precise as using tools.jvm, but it’s so much simpler and doesn’t involve evaluating the code.

I think something like this should be the direction for us, as everything else is too complicated IMO.

Btw, on the client-side now we also have the option to use the native elisp parseclj library.

yeah i might end up writing an analyzer but does feel like an easy option ;)

i use rewrite-clj in mranderson now but still a long way from there to an analyzer which can give is global and local vara

vars

seen borkdude's tweets and announcements about clj-kondo will check it out more in depth

I’ve yet to check the exact AST format, but I assume we can figure out most locals and globals with simple heuristics. I’d rather have a simple runtime-independent solution that works well most of the time, than a very complex solution that works all of the time.

we agree on that one

bit like joker i suppose in the sense that you explicitly need to teach it your custom macros if they add defs

if i understand right

Yeah, but I think that’s perfectly fine.

It’s the only way to avoid having to expand the macros anyways.

(or you can annotate macros with some metadata, which would be my preferred approach)

Coworker of mine made an lsp server

What did he use for the static analysis?

Not sure. Let me dig it up

Clj-rewrite it seems from looking at the reps

ok so there may be quite a bit of proof out there proving that it can be done

is this public repo @dpsutton?

Yes. On mobile but GitHub user is snoe

Closure lsp

cheers

this is really interesting @dpsutton thanks for mentioning it.

I use it at work. It’s been very nice. Refactoring, reference navigation, etc

it says it has find usages etc on tin.

really impressed so far

i will deffo try it

you don’t really need cider as a fronted for such a thing, right?

Nope

Its lacking eldoc which I rely on a lot but otherwise pretty good

i mean lsp-mode is the frontend i assume

Yes

There are some config info for emacs in the reader

Read me

yup seen that

this is really exciting actually. this is a direct competitor of cider — if such a thing exists in open source terms 😉

It needs a good layer to wrap up the refactoring commands

It has some threading rewriting stuff

LSP is likely going to be become a big deal for every language in the years to come.

For Lisps is a bit weird to running tooling outside the REPL (at least for me it’s weird), but LSP makes a lot of sense in general.

yes. and also might drastically lower the barrier for newcomers. CIDER is fantastic but if someone just grabs an lsp-aware editor and is up and running that is a good thing for sure

Yeah, although I guess this would mean less people on Emacs as well. 🙂

snoe/lsp can benefit from being dynamic instead of driven by file analysis

agree with the Ghadi lsp is just a protocol after all

like nRepl

Well, it you can implement it in terms of a running REPL, that’s true.

I guess that if it even makes sense, there could be a REPL-driven mode with static analysis backup

well...I don't know what could happen if the two clash though 😄

I disagree that tooling should be "good enough". I want tooling that is reliable so I don't have to swear every time I cut a finger on a sharp edge. "Great, now my completion doesn't work because I'm using a macro".

the LSP server should be embedded within the repl application

not separate. Other langs need the separation, but we don't

the author, case, is my coworker and is more than happy to have contributors

cool! @dpsutton thank him for me

i will pass that along. do you use it?

Well, at some point I suggested an LSP server which simply proxies to an nREPL server (or whatever). That’s how I would have done it, but in general for me LSP doesn’t really add much value to our existing setup.

no, but we looked at it in relation to REBL

@bozhidar yes that's the way to go imho

i think he will be quite pleased to hear that

There are 0 technical limitations to doing the static analysis directly from a REPL-powered tool, I just never liked tools analyzer and the need to evaluate the source files to build the AST.

you can override the need to evaluate in tools.analyzer

what do we need to analyze, btw? get position context for better autocompletion?

@ghadi No, we need some AST for things like find usages, replace var, etc.

It’s also useful for linting purposes - e.g. getting arity warnings without the need to run a separate lint tool, etc.

Generally find & replace are the most important usages as far as I’m concerned. Unfortunately they can’t be reliably implemented without analyzing the entire project.

ah, cool

Anyways, I really hope we’ll do more on the static analysis front one way or another soon.

As for LSP - that’s not something I’m particularly interested myself (at least with respect to Clojure), but I’m happy to see progress on that front and I hope someone will do an nREPL backed LSP server implementation at some point.

bci