I have some functions that are responsible for the orchestration (I will refer as comp-fns) of some other fns, however these comp-fns receive several arguments (6+) what is the more idiomatic way to handle this situation? Pass the parameters as hash-maps?

yeah, with more than four args I like a hash map with named keys, as it's impossible to tell if the args are right just by looking when there's that many

and kwargs aren't usually worth the extra trouble imho

cool o/

Heyo

Hi to all

Welcome @stevannestorovic! Just started learning Clojure?

@seancorfield not my welcome to take, but funny you ask that as I've been asking myself a lot of things lately. over the past 13 years I've gone ruby -> learning clojure -> go -> ok, i like clojure -> rust -> ok, i'm going to build everything I can build in clojure. which, written out, sounds funny and almost a denial of where terrible orange site comments would tell you to go. just saying, 6 years ago was the best time to pick up clojure, now is the second best time.

a little more difficult given my day to day is working on OSS on kubernetes, but. 😄

My journey has been all over the map over the last 40 years. And it's touched on Lisp a couple of times.

I like Rust. I didn't like Go. Didn't like Ruby either. But languages are very subjective.

@seancorfield Curious to ask what’s the major reason that you don’t like Ruby? btw, i’ve been programming Ruby for past few years, now just start stepping into Clojure/Clojurescript :face_with_raised_eyebrow:

and I hate Java, don’t quite like C++ 😂

@godwin.ko Purely subjective. I've been a language designer/implementer since the very early 80's so I have very strong opinions on what makes a readable, maintainable language -- and Ruby fails miserably on my criteria.

I was on the C++ Standards Committee for eight years so you can blame some of your dislike on me 🙂

I co-wrote one of the first three ANSI-validated C compilers. I wrote a C++ compiler front end. I designed an ML-like language/interpreter back in the early 80's.

So... Ruby... bleh 😞 🙂

but Ruby/Python is good for newcomers with no computer science background, just hack and using whatever popular framework/library, and it works most of the time 😂

Clojure is as close to a piece of perfect language design as I've found in forty years.

Python's fine. I like Python. Such a shame about the 2.7/3.x split tho'.

Clojure is cool, maybe most Lisp dialects are cool in different aspects

I attended PyCon 2013 since it was local and it all looked so promising. They said "about five years" for everything to be cut over to 3.x. Sigh.

But Python 3.x is a nice piece of design.

that’s not gonna happen, legacy app stay much longer than we think or want :thinking_face:

it’s funny that, when I talk to every local developers that I’m jumping into Clojure, almost everyone warned me that nobody is using it, hard to recruit developers, hard to train team members, … etc.

No one warned me. No one had heard of it when I started in 2010 🙂

Hi guys, I have a basic cljs->js interop question: I need to assign something to an array element, but couldn't find how to do it. I am trying to use sheetjs and trying to use this line wb.Sheets["Test Sheet"] = ws;. I've tried (set! (.-Sheets wb "Test Sheet" ) ws) and (set! (.-Sheets "Test Sheet" wb ) ws) but figwheel throws error.

I can add / update multiple values in a map using both (assoc {:a 2} :a 5 :b 5) and (merge {:a 2} {:a 5 :b 5). Which one should be preferred ?

hey guys, I’m using atom + protorepl .. starting my new code to use clj tools deps .. how you guys starting the nrepl on your projects ?

want to connect, from my atom, using protorepl

is this https://clojure.github.io/core.incubator/clojure.core.strint-api.html deprecated?

I have this:

No such namespace: clojure.core.strint, could not locate clojure/core/strint.cljs, clojure/core/strint.cljc, or JavaScript source providing "clojure.core.strint" in file src/guestbook/core.cljs

that's a very old ns from clojure-contrib, so yes

gotcha. thanks

Hi folks. I know I’m using with-redefs-fn improperly here but I don’t know what I’m doing wrong.

what is the time namespace?

that’s https://github.com/dm3/clojure.java-time

with-redefs is not the preferred way to do mocking with that lib, check out https://github.com/dm3/clojure.java-time#clocks!

with-redefs has some issues that can make it tricky to use and in particular to understand when it doesn’t work

ah okay, let me fiddle around with that. Thanks!

@schmee that was it. thank you again!

you’re welcome! 🙂

how does refer or refer-clojure differ from require ?

@murtaza52 require loads a namespace (if it isn't already loaded) and can give the namespace a local alias (`:as`) and can also intern symbols from that namespace into the current namespace (so they are accessible without the alias) -- using :refer. refer itself does the same as require's :refer option -- but does not load the namespace first. refer-clojure is a shorthand for (refer 'clojure.core <options>)

It's very rare to use the refer function since you normally need to load a namespace before first use, and it's easier to combine the require and refer operations in a single require with the :refer option.

refer-clojure is generally only needed when you are deliberately defining symbols in your namespace that "shadow" something in clojure.core and want to avoid the warning the compiler gives about replacing symbol definitions.

For example, https://github.com/clojure/clojure/blob/master/src/clj/clojure/string.clj#L42 -- since clojure.string defines replace and reverse that shadow (hide/replace) those two definitions in clojure.core.

Does that help @murtaza52?

@seancorfield so if I understood correctly require loads a ns and refer interns the vars from that ns.

what do you mean by loading a ns ? can you explain that a bit more

Yes. And (require '[some-lib.ns :refer [func1 func2]]) is the same as (require 'some-lib.ns) followed by (refer 'some-lib.ns :only ['func1 'func2])

Loading a namespace -- if it has been loaded yet, find the expected matching file on disk, read it in and compile it form by form.

So, in general (require '[some-lib.ns]) would look for some_lib/ns.clj somewhere on the class path (e.g., in src) and then load & compile it.

@murtaza52 Feel free to ask more questions. I have to step away but I expect someone else can pick up and answer those...

when you say compile, that means JIT kicking in to compile the bytecode down to machine code ?

@seancorfield thanks, your replies were very helpful

Compile = compile Clojure source down to JVM byte code.

The JVM itself handles compilation to native code, as it sees fit (i.e., for hot spots in the code).

Dear cool Clojure people… (.parse (java.text.SimpleDateFormat. "MMM/dd/yy H a") "AUG/10/2019 04:22 AM") any clue on how to parse this date format correctly? I am not sure how to get this date formatter to work.

this is the dataset I am working with: (slurp "")

… also I hate nonstandard datestrings.

Never mind. 😐

It’s always something stupid. ¯\(ツ)/¯

just fyi, that SimpleDateFormat object is not thread-safe - you're fine there because you're creating a new one every time, but don't like put it in a def and use it from multiple threads

@cameronleslie I recommend using https://docs.oracle.com/javase/8/docs/api/java/time/format/DateTimeFormatter.html and other java.time over java.util.Date and SimpleDateFormat, if that’s possible in your case

@schmee if this small script “turns into a thing”, I will totally follow that advice. Bookmarked. Thank you!

@alexmiller is there a plan to make a second edition of your wonderful "Clojure Applied" or there is not much change since the publishing?

Definitely could be updated. But we have no imminent plans to do so :)

@alexmiller what would you add or remove (if any) ?

Would revise some of ch 1 advice on records

Would add spec

do you still consider records for domain modeling? or just plain maps with specs is encouraged nowadays?

Might add some stuff on clj and tools.deps now.

Records and maps is a balance. I’d tilt back more towards maps now

Protocol metadata makes maps suitable in more scenarios than before

@alexmiller thanks, I'm using Programming Clojure 3rd and Clojure applied as learning resource, do you have any recomendations for a " updated , idiomatic and /or best practices " book?

Russ’s Getting Clojure is great

@alexmiller thanks!!